Saturday, December 07, 2019

Silence Those Who Disagree and Lose Your Liberty

The far left and the far right of political, religious, and cultural movements both attempt to suppress dissent.

Those in power fall into the trap of believing that silencing  minority opinions is somehow beneficial.

But silence those who disagree and it's only a matter of time before citizens of a country, members of a church, or inhabitants of a culture lose their liberty.

Let me give you an example.

In 1950, Immanuel Velikovsky, a polymath student and friend of both Sigmund Freud and Albert Einstein, wrote a book called Worlds in Collision.

Velikovsky used documentation from the ancient Greeks, Egyptians, and Hebrews to explain how volcanoes formed mountain ranges, massive meteoric showers destroyed entire civilizations, and oceanic tidal waves flooded areas of the earth on a regular basis in relatively recent human history (e.g. 2200 BC, 1500 BC, 650 BC).

Velikovsky wrote that all the ancient Greek and Roman legends have their heroes revolve around Jupiter (Greek: Zeus), the god of  "sky and thunder," as well as Saturn, Venus, and Mars, because these planets passed close to earth during early recorded human history on their way to their current planetary orbits. Velikovsky called these near celestial collisions Worlds in Collision.

According to Velikovsky, the ancient cataclysms are  described by religions and people groups across the globe, including the Hebrews in their Scriptures.

An evolutionist himself, Velikovsky believed that mankind is in amnesia about these cataclysms. He writes:
"The agitation and trepidation preceding global upheavals, the destruction and despair that accompanied them and the horror of possible repetition all caused a variety of reactions, at the base of which was the need to forget, but also the urge to emulate."-                                                                                                          Immanuel Velikovsky
When MacMillan Company first published Worlds in Collision in 1950, the radical left of the scientific and academic communities went ballistic. They organized boycotts of university textbooks published by McMillan, forcing the company to transfer publishing rights of Worlds in Collision to another company. The academic intelligentsia personally blackballed Velikovsky, calling him a pseudo-scientist at best, and a quack at worst.

Velikovsky's belief that the earth has been through massive upheavals in mankind's recent past is directly contradictory to steady-state evolutionist theories of academia.

As a result of these intimidating tactics against Dr. Immanuel Velikovsky by the radical left, there has been a loss of true open and frank dialogue with dissenting scholars in our higher education system in America.

In other words, American universities are no longer free.

Faculty, students, and researchers must hold to the leftist party line of those in power.

However, the left has no monopoly on silencing dissent.

Charlemagne (AD 748-814), a "Christian" king and first emperor of the Holy Roman Empire, massacred thousands who refused to be "baptized" as a Christian.

Adolph Hitler, following the example of Charlemagne, purged Germany of anyone not Christian and not German. Hitler desired a Third Reich (Empire) of German rule. In the 1930s, the Nazis held official book burning ceremonies to eradicate any publication that offered an alternative view to the principle of blood purity, nationalism, and German colonial expansion.

Radical Muslims today are killing infidels, silencing anyone who opposes their attempt to establish a world-wide caliphate.

But listen carefully. There are some liberty-loving, kind and caring Muslims who oppose the far right radicalism of Islamic fundamentalism.

Read for yourself what these peace-loving Muslims say.

I have many friends who are Muslim. I don't agree with their religion, but I support them in their attempts to publish their dissenting opinions. What no lover of liberty can accept, and my Muslim friends agree, are the intimidation tactics against those who disagree.

Rachelle in the Christmas Market of Nuremberg (white hat)
Rachelle and I were standing this past week in the Christmas Market in the historic downtown square of Nuremberg, Germany, drinking coffee by a warm fire, when a nice German woman asked my wife what she thought of Donald Trump.

I noticed a young German man standing next to the fire, warming his hands, watching my wife very intently as she told the woman that she liked Donald Trump as President, particularly his economic business policies, and she would vote for him again. She also said she wished our President wouldn't do and say some of the stupid things that he has said and done, but she feels he's been good for the economy of the United States.

As the young man listened to my wife, he didn't blink. He stared. You could tell he was angry. Then, in a very intimidating voice, he said something to my wife that made our spirits grow as cold as our hands.

We left the center of Nuremberg and realized that our world is filled with radicals, both left and right, who wish to silence those who disagree with them.

The young German man who rebuked my wife was a radical political liberal. He couldn't stand the thought of my wife's opinion being expressed out loud. He attempted to silence through intimidation someone with whom he disagreed.

The radicals on the right do it. The radicals on the left do it.

I left Nuremberg with a renewed resolved to defend everyone's freedom to speak, write, and believe whatever they wish.

Velikovsky, a close friend of Albert Einstein and Sigmund Freud, became the target of a coordinated campaign to blackball him and his writings from the leftist intelligentsia in power.

The Velikovsky Affair is something that I've studied for over a decade, and it's given to me three insights into today's political, religious, and cultural conflicts:
1. If either the right or the left uses bullying tactics to intentionally silence dissenting  opinions, it's incumbent on me to resist those in power and defend the minority's right to speak, even if I don't hold to the minority opinion. 
2. University scholars, religious clergy, and national party leaders must be regularly reminded how fragile any institution is unless free and open discussion takes place, which includes the toleration and protection of those who espouse dissenting viewpoints.  
3. Any authoritative demand for absolute  conformity ends in the loss of liberty for all individuals and the eventual collapse of the institutions themselves.
Let freedom ring!


Anonymous said...

Fantastic post!

Many years ago we were in Leadville Co touring the mining museum. There is a room there (or was at least) with samples of many different ores and minerals from around the world. The beauty is breathtaking to say the least. I quietly commented to my granddaughter (preschooler) "God sure made a beautiful world, didn't he?"

A man on the far side of the room immediately came very aggressively towards me, ranting wild eyed about that meant I believe in a God that creates brain worms in S.A. that destroys small children, creates gay people and hates them, condemns blacks to be beasts of burden, and is personally responsible for every evil thing that happens on earth.

I quietly told him he was bothering us, but that no, I did not say I believed any of those things. I personally hold to a theology of free will, that mankind's choice brought about the fall and all that evil, that it was no surprise to God and that He had already planned the remedy, Christ, before creating the universe which was initially "good." We then moved away from him. He continued to stalk us and rant at us so we quickly rejoined my hubby. One look from dh and the ranter left the building.

Granddaughter commented something about the guy needed to go back to school and learn it is not nice to throw tantrums.


Wade Burleson said...


Your granddaughter takes after you! Smart cookie!

Anonymous said...

Thank you! If only I had her musical talent and her scientific mind!


Rex Ray said...


Hitler didn’t allow women to wear lipstick and had “God we trust” on belt buckles of soldiers. He wanted to create a ‘Master Race’ of Germans to rule the world, thus he executed ‘cripple and ‘inferior’ people’ along with the Jews.

At age 16, we attended one of 13 trials of ‘Master Race' held in Nuremberg.

I like what Richelle said about President Trump. I hope she doesn’t think “draining the swamp’ was one of the stupid things he said. I think the ‘swamp’ includes this guy:

Rex Ray said...


Your reply to the “ranter’ would have made a normal person realize the truth, but he must have had bad experiences and blamed God.

You mentioned Leadville, Colorado. I’ve taught school at Fairplay; 16 miles away as a crow would fly, but 62 miles by car.

Tom said...


In the Comments section of this blog, I have personally experienced the ranting of other commenters when my views have differed from theirs. There was no acceptance on their part that we were both saying the same thing but because the expressed views on my part were not acceptable to the other, I was being forced to conform to that commenter's perceived point of view or understanding.

This has also been noticeable where people's esteemed "leaders" have been put under the microscope and unfavourable critiques of that "leader" have been presented. These people have resorted to flawed argument techniques in attempts to "win," or supress the commenters who hold to a very different understanding of the "facts."

Rarely do I see where posts have been deleted where dissenting POV have been posted in the comments section of this blog.

Also, people with strong personalities tend to inhibit open and frank interactions between commenters as it is "safer" to withdraw from further discussion or even to not post a comment because of the feared response from these strong personalities.

How strongly we feel about a topic should not inhibit our respect of another’s POV.


Anonymous said...

Just read the blurb put out by Fonuts concerning Jinger Duggar Vuolo.

Apparently we will now be vetted by our own, our spouse's, and our family's opinions.

What a mess our country has become!


Wade Burleson said...

Tom, I agree with your assessment. However, you should know I do not, as a rule, delete any comments. It is an open forum.

RB Kuter said...

It's interesting that in all cases to which you spoke about factions that oppress the free expression of thought and opinion, they were/are notably insecure, fearful, and threatened by any opposition that might diminish their control and power. Attempts to silence always seems to be based on those premises. Reminds me of the power players in the Jewish structure in the times of Jesus.

In contrast, those who are confident in their position as being right, righteous, rational, and based upon God's truth, do not feel the need to oppress the opinions of others voiced in opposition to theirs. Some friends in my church get very distraught by those holding opposing political views than their own but do not get worked up about other religions, cults, and non-believers, as much.

I "think" it may be (at least I hope it is) because they are confident in their spiritual security in Christ but maybe not so much about our political future.

Anonymous said...

The level of intellectual dishonesty in this is absolutely atrocious. I know you’re smart, so I will not spend time on assuming you don’t know: rather just pointing out what seems like intentional tribalism.

“Radical Muslims today are killing infidels, silencing anyone who opposes their attempt to establish a world-wide caliphate.
But listen carefully. There are some liberty-loving, kind and caring Muslims who oppose the far right radicalism of Islamic fundamentalism.”
1) You betray your intent here by using “some.” The majority of Muslims worldwide denounce this. Your choice of language betrays your “tribe over fact” thought process.
2) Isn’t the President you are drooling over the one who is trying to get Illhan Omar killed... for saying something he doesn’t like?
Isn’t the President you are drooling over the one who Tweeted intimidation to a witness on a sand... for saying something he doesn’t like?
Isn’t the President you are drooling over the one who blocks people on Twitter, against Federal Law, for saying things he doesn’t like?

So, how can you possibly say with a straight face that you value those things while voting for the worst possible person for those very things?

“ my wife very intently as she told the woman that she liked Donald Trump as President, particularly his economic business policies, ”
I, again, know you aren’t stupid people.
You know tariffs are paid for by consumers.
You know taxpayers have had to pay billions in farming subsidies because of the Trump trade war disaster.
You know Trump is losing the trade war by the metrics he himself values.
You also know Presidential actions have little bearing on this and Trump, particularly, has done very little legislatively due to Democratic Congress to have impacted anything on his own.

So, on what basis do you find that belief?

“silence through intimidation”
“Being intimidated” is a choice, the same as “being shamed.”
Cut that victimhood crap out.

“ made our spirits grow as cold as our hands”
All I have to say of this is I’m getting so, so tired of constantly hearing the victimhood nonsense from the right like this. You’re the least-persecuted demographic in the country, get over yourself.

You hadn’t considered, or at least bothered to write, the fact that Trump is hated the world over and what Germans actually think about Trump.
Trump called Germans “very bad” people and threatened to shred their trade. They’re the worlds third largest exporters. 78% of Germans dislike Trump. Only 11% believe he has any integrity: that number was 88% the last year of Obama’s administration.
He pulled out of the Iran nuclear deal they heavily supported.
To put this in perspective: Germans believe Putin is a better quality leader than Trump.

I, again, don’t think you’re stupid.
But I do think you live in a tiny conservative bubble and when you were straight-up confronted with the way the majority of the world thinks (and the majority of this country) to consider yourself a victim... it comes across as very, very selfish. It belittles the actual experience and views of the German people.

“I think our President is doing great wonders economically. Of course this is the same guy who said you were bad people and threatened to cripple YOUR economics.”

Imagine coming out of that believing YOU were the victimized.
Wade Burleson.

Anonymous said...

Rex--we were in Trinidad for many years. That was a strange summer on many fronts. Fairly new in town we were still searching for a church home. We noticed there was a group of other visitors showing up wherever we visited. Long story short, it was an organized special interest group that opposed what conservative churches teach on their issue. There were plenty of churches in Trinidad that agreed with them, but they would not attend nor join them. Instead they serially joined conservative groups, began their own howl to change things, then invariably branded the church as "haters" for not changing and moved on to another one. Last time I was there those folks were still in town and no longer attending church anywhere. None of the conservative churches had changed on the issue, and there were several liberal churches that agreed with them. As a side note, one of that group was attending a Bible study I also attended. One night she said she needed a large print Bible for her daughter, and that she doubted either of them were saved. I had a large print NIV I wasn't using. I wrote in the front what I always write in gift Bibles: a prayer that it will bless the recipient and a bare bones simple "plan of salvation" using only scripture references and titles like all are sinners, the penalty of sin, and God's remedy. Gave it to them the next week. Week after that she came to church and chewed me out for thinking any of us are sinners (I sure know I am!) and never came back to that church for years. Sometimes you just can't win I guess:) Later ran into her in Safeway and she was friendly and thanked me for just talking to her, as most people in town she felt shunned her. She thanked me for my friendship. I still pray they are not, in their words, still very unsaved.


Wade Burleson said...


You're comment stands, even though it looks like my name at the end means I'm the author of it. You have a couple of days to explain why you put my name at the end of your comment. If you want me to think about what you've written, I'll be happy to do so, but make sure your punctuation and grammar convey what you intend - as in "Wade Burleson, imagine coming out of that believing YOU were victimized." I believe that may be what you intended to write.

Christiane said...

Wade, I have always appreciated the opportunity to express myself here, and I have never felt that anyone here was not permitted to speak freely. I don't know if you realize this, but this is a rather wonderful thing . . . trusting that this freedom given to people is a good thing, rather than something to be frightened of or something to 'control'.

The Spirit goes where He wills. And people are infinitely more important to us than their political viewpoints indeed. And when more Americans realize that truth, our country will no longer be so divided.

Thank you for this gift of allowing people the freedom to speak out and express their thoughts even when many disagreed with them. How else can be come to understand one another? We must try to have dialogue and to listen to one another, even in the most difficult of seasons.

'all shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well'
(St. Julian of Norwich)

Christiane said...

A film for all seasons:

RB Kuter said...

Either "Anonymous" has worked him/herself up to such a frenzy as to make comments undiscernible or perhaps is struggling to communicate with a mother language other than English. Either way, the comments are difficult to understand.

I would like to express my thoughts on what may be one point to which "anonymous" speaks writing, "But listen carefully. There are some liberty-loving, kind and caring Muslims who oppose the far right radicalism of Islamic fundamentalism.”

My personal position, based upon those "Muslims" I know personally and those most often affiliated with terrorist acts, is that Anonymous is "right on" in this assertion. I do not believe that the general strategy for Islamic global domination is through militancy.

1. As is in the case of professing "Christians" and most other religions, there are a LOT of professing "Muslims" who do not actively, seriously, pursue adherence to the teachings of their identified religion. They are not seriously committed to their religion even when living in countries controlled by Muslim extremists. They generally are not well versed on the basis of Islamic teachings nor do they voluntarily adhere to its practices as defined in the Koran. Instead, they identify with Islam primarily as a means of convenience within their society/culture.

Perhaps "most" professing "Christians" fall within these same parameters and the label is about the only thing that distinguishes them from anybody else.

2. There IS a Muslim movement for the globalization of Islam. I "imagine" it comes from the enchantment with the historical global pursuit of domination as portrayed during the reign of the Ottoman Empire which expanded over multiple centuries and a desire to return to that pre-WWI era.

The dominant strategy to achieve this globalization of Islam is NOT militant and definitely not by converting non-Muslims to Islam. The extremely effective strategy is instead to expand societal and political domination by flooding ever increasing target areas with Muslim immigrants along with increased growth of Muslim families, hence, polygamic practice.

It is a brilliant strategy which takes advantage of those democratic systems of the western hemisphere vulnerable to such methods of domination due to their ideologies of majority rule. This assessment is not simply conjecture but proven by its occurrence in France and many other western European nations, Asia, Africa, and now very apparent in areas of the United States.

Our democratic systems render us totally defenseless. With the imminent control of Islam of ever increasing areas the loss of democracies will be a certainty, but there is no defense. Look for rapidly increased numbers of Muslim politicians and a subsequent shifting of traditional political laws and societal trends that reflect Islamic rule without a bomb being exploded.

Christiane said...

I support our American citizens of all other faiths. Although I fear 'fundamentalists' in any religion, as they are showing behaviors that are extreme and destructive and negative. Some say that fundamentalism is a form of illness, and I have wondered about that from the comments and behaviors of some of these people, yes.

What we can determine is that in our own Christian faith, we can look at the 'fruit' of the Holy Spirit in the life of a person, and if it IS present in how they treat their own and 'the others' also, then we can 'recognized' them as Christ-followers. But here's the thing:
these OTHER faiths also have people in them who are kind and patient and caring, and long-suffering, and do not harbor hatred for 'the others', and who show forth the kind of 'love' that honors Christ, even if they do not know His Name . . . that is a mystery that I think involves the truth that Our Lord took ALL of our human kind to Him when He was incarnated, and that by some way, known only to God, these of other faiths who show forth the fruit of the Holy Spirit are in someway connected to the Paschal mysteries of Our Lord.

Muslims in my community. Yes. Good people. Good Americans. Respected. Would that some Christians could be as kind and patient with one another and with 'the others' as these Muslims are. . . . . we can learn from them. Such people are deserving of our respect as 'neighbors' and we are fortunate to have them here among us.

Christiane said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Christiane said...

"Those nearest in love to the believers are those who say 'We are Christians'.
Among these are priests and monks and they wax not proud" (from the Koran)

Wade Burleson said...

Christiane and RB,

Excellent comments - thank you.

stevenstarkmusic said...

GDP and job growth are on the same basic trajectory they have been for a decade. Always curious what people mean by the president’s economic policies other than cheap debt, huge deficits in the face of full employment, and a disregard for long-term environmental security.

Bob Cleveland said...

It's surprising that there doesn't seem to have been any analogies to today's church. Several things come to mind:

Tongues/Prayer Languages
Miraculous Gifts
Instruments in Worship Services

There are other, but for instance I sure don't hear much positive said in Baptist churches, about Calvinism. I don't think it's encouraged at all.

Bob Cleveland said...

And the second one above makes me think of Brother Dwight McKissic and the SWBTS Chapel.

Steven Stark said...


I'm curious what your stance would be if a Southern Baptist seminary professor suddenly began teaching the resurrection as a non-literal event. How would you deal with that dissent?

RB Kuter said...

Bob, your point evades me. Are you proposing that dialogue on these issues is being oppressed in churches or on this blog or that proponents for the application of these are intimidated from speaking to them? Not sure.

Wade Burleson said...


A professor is an employee of an institution that requires a signature on what's called "a statement of faith." I believe it is the seminary's contractual right to have employees teach according to the seminary's "statement of faith."

I would fellowship with that person, but would not expect the seminary to continue to pay that person.

RB Kuter said...

Steven, do you think that majority opposition to a position constitutes oppression of speech or expression?

Bob Cleveland said...

RB KUTER: Not long ago, Dwight Mckissic's sermon in the SWBTS Chapel was removed from the seminary website, because Seminary leadership disagreed
. Start a Sunday School class teaching Calvinism and see how that goes. Tell people that they have the same gifts as the Apostles did. I dare say they would most likely be highly discouraged.

Steven Stark said...


Fair enough. But how is that different in principle from the majority of scholars disagreeing with Velikovsky? Perhaps they thought his positions were completely unwarranted. If so, shouldn’t they strive to keep a consistent level of methodology and discipline within their field? (Not judging Velikovsky, I’m not familiar, but questioning your overall point here about dissent).

....Just as biologists shouldn’t tolerate a complete rejection of evolution (without that discovery of the “pre-Cambrian rabbit”...) from those within the field.

RB, I do not.

Anonymous said...

Wade said: "Tom, I agree with your assessment. However, you should know I do not, as a rule, delete any comments. It is an open forum."

Well, I recently had a couple comments about 9/11 being planned by GOV deleted in your post about not always believing what you see on the internet (Aug 2019).

What's up with that? Ken

RB Kuter said...

Bob, I believe I understand what you are saying. There is a blurred boundary between rejecting someone's proposal in disagreement and oppressing freedom to express that proposal. I can understand how an institution might not want to identify with the position of some. Granted, the institution would probably be more prudent in acquiring an understanding of what a speaker would be propagating prior to giving them a forum identified with that institution and then simply not inviting them to speak if those in the institution determined it to be contrary to their position. That could avoid embarrassment on the part of the institution and I would not consider that to be denying someone freedom of speech or expression in a general sense. Surely institutions have that prerogative.

Regarding teaching from a pro or anti-Calvinistic position in a Bible study group as well as some of the other doctrinal issues you mention, the reception of the presentation would always be according to the audience and its biasness in one direction of another. You would expect that, right?

Bob Cleveland said...

RB: I have taught about Calvinism, and what Calvinists believe. In fact, I once took the articles of Faith from the AOG, SBC, United Methodists and Presbyterians, separated their beliefs by Scripture, Church, Jesus, God, and the Holy Spirit. When I read them to the class, the mostly could not tell which was which.

I then explained the differences in beliefs. I did all that because, while we do teach about Islam, etc, our people are more confronted by Pentecostals, JW's, Mormons and the like, than they are Muslims.

Rex Ray said...


Sounds like Trinidad didn’t have many Baptist. When we moved to Fairplay, Colorado there was a Baptist Church that had been organized a few months before. They were glad to have my wife and me join as much as we were to find a Baptist Church.,_Colorado

“A historic gold mining settlement, the town was founded in 1859 during the early days of the Pike's Peak Gold Rush. The town was named by settlers who were upset by the generous mining claims given to the earliest prospectors and promised a more equitable system for its residents.”

The altitude is almost two miles high. (9,953 feet) Playing basketball almost killed me. :)

Rex Ray said...

New story,

Our parents got jobs to teach military kids in Germany right after World War II. About half way across, we were in a small storm. Our small boat bobbed up and down like a cork. Every time the ship plowed into a wave, a spray of water covered the deck; making it slick. The deck was about a hundred feet wide. The large waves rolled the ship back and forth. One side would be high in the air, and then low; close to the water.

At 15, Hez and I had a lot of fun sliding back and forth. We’d slide from the high side to the low side. Then wait for it to be the high side. No one knew we were there.

Fun stopped when the ‘high side’ went really high. I was going so fast when I hit the other rail, I almost flipped over. It seemed like eternity as I gripped the rail, balanced like a
seesaw looking at freezing water.

RB Kuter said...

"our people are more confronted by Pentecostals, JW's, Mormons and the like, than they are Muslims."

Bob, that is true and most of our folks are ill-prepared to deal with members of these groups when they are encountered. Most of the time, our people respond to their visits with anger, slamming the door in their face and citing Biblical references saying not to allow heathens into your house. Good on you for attempting to equip our members with the understanding of these critical doctrinal truths so they will be equipped to share it with members of those cults and perhaps plant a seed of the true Gospel in one of their hearts.

Rex Ray said...

RB Kuter,

When Jehovah’s Witness come to visit my sister, they leave as soon as she suggest they have prayer together.

Christiane said...

We have so much to be thankful for in this country.

WHY IS THIS HAPPENING? we are better than this, surely . . .

Lee Saunders said...

It's equally impossible in the various venues of American Christianity for people to exercise any freedom of speech. I've got a long list of friends with whom I attended college or seminary who were preparing for ministry who now won't darken the doorway of a church because there was some aspect of theology to which they didn't subscribe and when they trusted their listeners, found themselves facing being fired from a church or denominationally related position because of it. We're talking differences in interpretation of scripture regarding women serving in the church or ministry, sign gifts of the spirit and in one case, recommending an African American man to serve as a deacon. I never imagined I would get to this point and be the last in my circle of friends from Southern Baptist-related educational institutions to still be worshipping in a conservative, Evangelical church.

Anonymous said...

Rex, when we were there as I recall one independent fundamentalist Baptist church and one SBC in the process of 9marx reforming.


RB Kuter said...

Rex Ray, not sure if they agreed to pray "with" me, when they visited but I always propose to JW and Mormon visitors that we both pray because both of us cannot be right so we need to pray asking that God tell us which one is wrong and which one is right. I guess neither of us has heard Him respond that we are wrong; either that or they are not listening to Him.

Wade Burleson said...

"Well, I recently had a couple comments about 9/11 being planned by GOV deleted in your post about not always believing what you see on the internet (Aug 2019).

What's up with that? Ken"

If you comment on a post that has been up for over 45 days, the comments do not post (they go into a filter). I am a very busy man and probably check the filter once every six months. Sorry, Ken. The reason for this is to keep SPAM (Las Vegas Casinos, health and wellness coaches, etc...) from posting on all old posts.


Anonymous said...

"If you comment on a post that has been up for over 45 days, the comments do not post (they go into a filter). I am a very busy man and probably check the filter once every six months. Sorry, Ken. The reason for this is to keep SPAM (Las Vegas Casinos, health and wellness coaches, etc...) from posting on all old posts. "

Wade, that wasn't the case. Shortly after you posted it I was in the midst of a conversation with Rex when my posts were deleted by the moderator. Ken

Rex Ray said...


You said. “I was in the midst of a conversation with Rex when my posts were deleted by the moderator.”

I was disappointed you didn’t reply to my comments made on Wade’s post of November 29 on Sat Dec 07, 03:43:00 PM 2019 and Tue Dec 10, 10:47:00 AM 2019. I guess that explains it.

Wade, I don’t see how you have the time and skill to have such an excellent blog. Like they say: “There’s nothing perfect done by man”. Or did I just dream that statement? :)

Christiane said...

Hey out there REX RAY,

touching base to see how you are doing . . . hope all is as well as can be on your end. We are completing house renovations finally and I'm on meds for an allergy to medication . . . and so it goes :)

God is good. The season of the Coming of the Light is near and we will honor Christ's birth once more on this Earth, and I'm hopeful of the good will that may come to us all during this season when there is so much discontent and yet we are so blessed in this country.

You take care of yourself. Do what is right and listen to Judy and to your doctors. You have have my prayers for your well-being. God Bless!

I wrote the story on another blog about a long-ago Christmas in New Jersey, when we lived there and I will share this with you who has told me so many great stories:

Here is what happened to us one Christmas (over forty years ago):

"yes, the Griswald Christmas tree . . . . I can identify.
Forty years ago or so, my husband and friends went out into the woods of New York to find a TREE, and they did. It was a perfect tree or so my husband thought. It was however, a little bit big. It wouldn't fit through the front door at all, so a plan was made to cart it up to the second story deck and bring it in through a large Andersen window in the dining room. We had to move all the furniture out first, the tree was that large. The furniture included a heavy teak table. and the light fixture had to be adjusted also.

So in comes the tree.

And then, after much effort, husband and friends tried to put the tree vertical into a stand, but it was TOO BIG, so they finagled a way to get it upright with a hand-made wooden stand. So it went up but it was too tall, so they cut the top off, which changed the shape rather more into a rectangle than a cone, so my husband got out the saw and 'pruned' the top of the tree.

The story gets worse.

The lights are put on. Not enough lights for this tree, so my husband goes and buys another XXX dollars worth of lights. When the tree is lit up, before the decorations are to go on, someone yells 'stop' there's something moving in there': it was a bevy of wolf spiders, those ugly, not so little spiders that give you the creeps. (sigh) The tree was infested all right. We were cursed. No, we kept the tree up 'til after Christmas and then my husband and friends (?), dressed in their version of hazmat suits, took the tree down out of the window, and to the curb. Where it partially blocked the driveway. You cannot make this stuff up.

Yeah, I can identify. Been there. No fun. Better to cut some fresh camellia leaves out in the garden, so shiny and green they are, come to think of it. And leave the trees in the forest for the creatures to live in, in peace."

well, that's the story, REX RAY . . . wolf spiders and all . . . . long time ago (sigh)

Rex Ray said...



I’ve stored it in my permanent files with the title, “Christiane tells funny Christmas tree story.”

I’ve already run off copies in the hope you’ll give permission for them to be given to our SS classes.

Christiane said...

please do share it . . . it may help someone not to have a similar disaster

and let me know how you are doing with your health . . . take care!

Anonymous said...

Our Christmas tree one year when the kids were little was a travelling one.

My husband was working Wyoming but we lived in ND. He brought back a floor to ceiling one he cut in Wy and brought home with him. We did not have a stand large enough for it and it would need watering, so he managed to hack out frozen dirt from the back yard and fill a large bucket. We put the tree up, decorated it, and all was well.

Until a couple of days later, that is. While he was at the office and I was home alone with a second grader and a toddler, the tree decided to travel again aka fall over. Kids and I were having morning Bible story, I looked up and saw the tree start over. I leaped and grabbed it, and had my son call dad at the office. Luckily I remembered the number. About 20 minutes and two tired arms later dh arrived. The frozen dirt had thawed out. We righted the tree and tied it to the wall with heavy twine.


Christiane said...

Linda, I can see it all from your description and I get it, yes

. . . Christmas tree stories abound in our families in this country, some wonderful, some weird, but all meant to celebrate the Coming of Light into the darkness and to make for our children memories to keep of that celebration so when we are gone on, they will still be able to keep Christmas

tonight is St.Lucia celebration, which if you have Scandinavian ancestors, you might know of, and even if you don't, you might find meaningful the imagery of the Light in the darkness:

Rex Ray said...


Frozen dirt didn’t last; and two tired arms. That’s funny, but I bet it wasn’t at the time.


You asked about my health. You might remember three years ago, I got my back fractured going down my slide. The fracture was very low, but it caused me to ‘hunch over’ like the “Hunchback from Notre Dame”.

I developed a pinched nerve in my back that hurt only in the process of sitting down. I saw a chiropractor twice with no improvement. My trip to him today had the same results, but when I got off his table he said, “Hey! You’re not hunch over anymore!

He was right! I felt straight and taller. Had to make my cane longer to touch the floor. (Still have a bad ankle.)

The only thing different, I had spent $134 for some pills that were advertised to help bad knees. I’ve taken two of them. (WOW! Wouldn’t that make an advertisement if that was the reason.)

On a sober subject; I guess you’ve heard on Wednesday, December 17, President Trump will or will not be impeached for “Abuse of Power” and ‘Obstruction of Congress”.

“Obstruction of Congress” is based on Trump’s lawyers refusing to testify. My daughter sent a text to me saying, “For the record, I believe Obstruction of Congress is not impeachable; but it is commendable.” :)

Nancy Pelosi said they started working on impeaching Trump two and a half years ago. Democrats wanted to impeach President George W. Bush, and George H. Bush.

Jonathan Turley, a lawyer, and a professor at George Washington University told them, “You can’t break the laws of America just because you don’t like Trump.”

I believe if Congress had “Term limits”, they’d get of their high horse and get more done for America.

Christiane said...

"I developed a pinched nerve in my back that hurt only in the process of sitting down. I saw a chiropractor twice with no improvement. My trip to him today had the same results, but when I got off his table he said, “Hey! You’re not hunch over anymore!
He was right! I felt straight and taller. Had to make my cane longer to touch the floor."

Hey, REX RAY, this is GOOD NEWS!

as for Trump, he will be impeached . . .

I keep wondering why he 'ordered' all those witnesses and documents to be kept from being examined by the House of Representatives (aka 'the peoples' House)?

Now he wants no one to see his tax records. Okay. That makes sense what with his doings with Putin and the Saudis. There's a lot he doesn't want known. It is what it is.

I think he warrants more transparency before the citizens of our country, and if need be, he ought to be held accountable under the law for any activities that are anti the Constitution, sure.

I'm still holding to the truth that we are a nation of laws and are under the Constitution.
If this changes, we will no longer be 'America' . . . but I think I trust our people more than to be without hope.

In any case, let right be done. We can all hope for that. Even when we may disagree about how to go about it. I'm not a Putin fan. I don't think Russia is 'our friend'. And Tucker Carlson? He is disgraced for his comments pro-Putun and pro-Russia, when he knows that Russia IS an adversarial nation to our country. My opinion? Yep.

Do I want others to be able to have their own points of view? Absolutely.

Anonymous said...

Scott Shaver said...

"The peoples house".

What a joke. That thing is no more the "peoples' house than your house is a refuge for the homeless".

Christiane said...

Section 2: House of Representatives
Clause 1: Composition and election of Members
The House of Representatives shall be composed of Members chosen every second Year by the People of the several States, and the Electors in each State shall have the Qualifications requisite for Electors of the most numerous Branch of the State Legislature.

Section Two provides for the election of the House of Representatives every second year. Since Representatives are to be "chosen... by the People," State Governors are not allowed to appoint temporary replacements when vacancies occur in a state's delegation to the House of Representatives; instead, the Governor of the state is required by clause 4 to issue a writ of election calling a special election to fill the vacancy.

Christiane said...

Scott Shaver, would you happier under a 'federation' such as is 'elected' in Russia?
The elections are shams there. Putin controls everything utterly. His oligarchs robs the people blind.

I do know that many in our country no longer value democracy. But Russia's form of 'government' is openly tyrannical. It is what it is. Putin 'advises' Trump on matters of North Korea at Trump's request, so Putin is already setting a portion of US policy. You may get your preferred government after all, but I don't think you will thrive in it, no. And once our Constitution is done away with, there is no going back again.

Shame your people took 'oaths' to support the Constitution, but they did. They did. And now they are to betray it utterly and thwart the sound workings of the balance of powers that have prevented tyranny. Political power in exchange for a free country does not seem 'American' to me, no. I feel badly for all of our people who call the Constitution a 'joke'.

Christiane said...

Ken F said...

"And once our Constitution is done away with, there is no going back again."

Hi Christian,
I suspect there are many people on the right and the left who have the same fears, but they see it in very different ways. Both sides view the other side as trashing the constitution, and both sides believe they have good reasons for thinking this. On top of that, we have politicians on both sides who get rich by being in politics - we might already be closer to an oligarchy than you might think. I am hoping that the backlash from the current political scene will be a large majority of people who are more interested in dialogue than polemics, and a return to the days when there were liberal leaning and conservstive leaning politicians in both parties. Do you remember how Ronald Reagan and Tip O'Neill were good friends even though they were so far apart politically? I think we need more of that. Can you imagine Pelosi and Trump regularly getting together for drinks and golf?

Ken F said...

Autocorrect did a number on your name in my last comment. Sorry about that.

Anonymous said...


You said. “I was in the midst of a conversation with Rex when my posts were deleted by the moderator.”

I was disappointed you didn’t reply to my comments made on Wade’s post of November 29 on Sat Dec 07, 03:43:00 PM 2019 and Tue Dec 10, 10:47:00 AM 2019. I guess that explains it."

Rex, I won't pick up the discussion here, but propaganda runs so deep with our GOV that most Americans aren't willing to research outside the box of what they hear and see from them and the media (which they finance and control). So much that the US gov controls how history is written.

Here is a good site with information and perspective that is in the minority: