"I went to Jerusalem to become acquainted (Gk. istoria) with Cephas" - Paul's words from Galatians 1:18.

"Give Me Liberty or Give Me Death!" Has Turned Into "Take My Liberty and Keep Me from Dying!"

Photo: Dietmar Rabich (Wikimedia)
Some of my Christian friends think I'm a liberal. They know that I believe in equal rights for men and women in church and society. They also know that I believe two people in a homosexual marriage should have the same rights as all American citizens.

On the other hand, some of my non-Christian friends think that I'm a conservative. They know that I believe peace with God is found through faith in Jesus Christ, that the Bible is God's Word to mankind, and that all events fall under God's sovereign and good plan. Though I hold to these Christian beliefs strongly, I never want them forced on others.

In short, I believe in liberty. Individual liberty; not political conformity.

Our Founding Fathers understood the importance of liberty. They called it a Natural Right. That kind of human right is something that Nature, or Nature's God (per The Declaration of Independence) gives to every human being.

Natural Rights are universal, unalienable, and concurrent. That means, if one is removed, all others are lost.

The three Natural Rights identified by our Founding Fathers are:


We're living in a time when Americans are in danger of losing these Natural Rights. As time goes by, more and more government encroachment and intrusion occurs in our lives, our properties, our businesses, and our churches. We are living in a day when the government has ordered shut private businesses, closed corporate churches, and forced individuals to shelter in their homes - under threat of arrest - over fear of spreading Covid-19.

Americans are afraid of death. And because of that fear, it's hard for most Americans to comprehend that the loss of liberty is worse than death.

But our Founding Fathers understood.

Patrick Henry, just a few months before the start of the Revolutionary War (1776), gave a speech at St. John's Church in Richmond, Virginia. The auditorium was full of pastors from Virginia considering whether they should go home and lead their people to form a militia to fight for freedom from the tyranny of England. King George of England had stolen colonial property, broken contractual promises, and imprisoned colonial pastors, all in the name of "public good."

Patrick Henry had experienced the tyranny of the King of England firsthand. He knew that if the American colonialists didn't do something, their liberty would be lost forever. The loss of individual liberty meant the rise of governmental tyranny. Patrick Henry rose to speak to the pastors.

Time Magazine calls Patrick Henry's speech "one of the top 10 greatest speeches of all time." I've taken Patrick Henry's speech (7 minutes long), updated its language to the 21st century, and turned the issue from war against England to the forcible lockdown of our country during Covid-19.

You may be surprised how it reads. I would encourage every parent to read this to your children. The issues of 1775 are very similar to the issues of 2020.

Liberty is important to me. I have a brick from St. John's Church in my office with Henry's famous phrase written on it: "Give me liberty or give me death." It's a reminder to me that true liberty is both natural and spiritual. It is my obligation to speak on this subject because the protection of Natural Rights is essential to the greatness of America and the good of emotional, spiritual, and mental health. I have highlighted some of Patrick Henry's words which express fully my sentiments during these difficult times.


Give Me Liberty or Give Me Death
Patrick Henry

No man thinks more highly than I do of our country, as well as the abilities of the very worthy men and women who compose our various leaders. Americans often see the same subject in different lights; and, therefore, I hope it will not be thought disrespectful to those American citizens who view things differently if I shall speak my sentiments freely and without reserve
This is no time for pretense or ceremony. The question before our nation is one of serious consequences for our future as a country. For my own part, I consider it as nothing less as the question of freedom or tyranny; and in proportion to the magnitude of the subject ought to be the freedom of the debate. A straightforward debate is the only way that we can hope to arrive at truth and to fulfill the great responsibility which we hold to God and country. Should I keep back my opinions at such a time, through fear of giving offense, or worse, creating enemies of friends, I should consider myself as guilty of treason towards my country and of an act of disloyalty toward my God, which I revere above all earthly honors, religious positions, or earthly authorities.
It is natural for mankind to indulge in the illusions of hope. We are apt to shut our eyes against a painful truth and listen to the song of that siren till she transforms us into beasts. Is this wise for Americans engaged in a great and arduous struggle for liberty? Are we to be counted in the number of those who, having eyes, see not, and, having ears, hear not, the things which shall bring about our destruction? 
For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it may cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst, and to provide for it. I have but one lamp by which my feet are guided, and that is the lamp of experience. I know of no way of judging the future but by the past. And judging by the past, I wish to know what there has been in the conduct of our nation during the past 40 days to justify the shuttering of businesses and the closing of churches and other entities, locking down private citizens in their homes under threat of legal punishment?
Is it possible that our appeals to Natural Rights, including life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness only bring insidious smiles on powerful faces rather than intentional protection of those rights by political action? Are we being betrayed by payments from the government, payments created by debt which shall be a snare to our feet? Suffer yourselves not to be betrayed with cash. Ask yourselves how American citizens have begun to depend on government when a just government is designed to be dependent on its citizens. Are lockdowns and closures of private businesses, violations of our Natural Rights,  really necessary to stop the spread of a disease? Must we sacrifice our liberties?  Let us not deceive ourselves. These actions are implements of subjugation, the last arguments before tyranny. I ask everyone, what are the reasons for these measures except to force us into submission? Is there any other motive? Are there justifiable reasons for the forcible seizure and closure of private property? 
No, there are none. Were we persuaded to close, we would close. But forcible measures  are meant to bind and rivet us upon the chains of tyranny for which opponents of liberty have long been planning. And what do we have to stop them from taking our rights? Shall we try argument? We've been trying to persuade through our arguments. Have we anything new to offer on the subject? Yes. We offer the past. We were told surges would overwhelm our hospitals, millions would die, and the government needed to take away our liberties to prevent death. We gave up our liberties to prevent death. Let us not deceive ourselves any longer. 
We have done everything to avert the storm that is now coming. We have petitioned; we have demonstrated, we have supplicated, we have prostrated ourselves before leaders, and we have implored everyone to remove the shackles that bind our liberties.
Our petitions have been slighted; our demonstrations have produced arrests, and our appeals have been ignored. In vain we have tried to open our country. There is no longer any hope.
If we wish to be free - if we mean to preserve inviolate those rights for which we so long have been contending - and if we mean not to abandon our noble struggle to protect life, liberty, and the freedom to pursue individual happiness, we must not back down under threat of death. I repeat; we must not back down under threat of death. An appeal to the God of Hosts and going back to work is all that is left to us!
They tell us that we are cruel and do not respect life. They tell us we will be unable to cope with so formidable an adversary as one we cannot see. But when shall we be stronger? When shall we leave our homes and return to work? Shall it be next week? Next year? When will it be that they shall determine we shall be safe. Will it be when the authorities are in control of every aspect of our movements, including our homes, our businesses, and our churches? Shall we resist this tyranny by lying on our backs in our beds, hugging the comforts of our blankets with the phantom hope that things will be okay tomorrow, only to arise and see every former freedom now shackled?
No. We are not weak. We are able to cope with a formidable and unseen adversary if we make proper use of the means which the God of nature has given us. We have abilities to protect ourselves; responsibility to protect others; and the wisdom to know how. Millions of people armed in the holy cause of liberty are invincible against any force sent against us. Besides all this, we do not fight our battles alone. There is a just God who presides over the destinies of nations, and it is He who will fight our battles for us. 
The battle before us is not to the strong alone; it is to the vigilant, the active, the brave. We have no other option. We must pick up our lives and move forward. We must not retire from life. There can be no retreat into slavery and submission to government tyranny. We know what must be done. Our war against Covid-19 is inevitable and continual. Let it come. We must go on with our lives and fight the battle daily. We will be prepared.
It is in vain to do nothing. The government cries, "Trust us - we will protect you!" But there is no protection except that which we give ourselves. The next round that sweeps from the north this November will bring to our ears the cries of "shelter in place" and "shutter your business." But we can wait no longer. We must get back to work! Why stand idle any longer? 
What is it that we wish? Liberty!
What would they have? Bondage!
Is life is so dear, or peace so sweet, that we must gain both by sacrificing our Natural Rights? Forbid it, Almighty God!
I know not what course others may take; but as for me:
Give me liberty or give me death! 

(End of Speech)

_______________________________________

I will continue to lead out in feeding the hungry, visiting the sick and infirm, providing for families in need, and protecting the vulnerable. Even today, we developed plans for community enhancements among our ethnic minorities. We're on our way to feed 300 people tonight, and we're planning on opening a refuge center for women as soon as the Emergency Order is lifted. All of these ministries are non-government funded. We are good neighbors. The gospel of Jesus Christ is important to us. He came to set us free from sin. We aren't afraid of dying. In terms of our country, the loss of liberty is worse than death. 


40 comments:

Victorious said...

Wade said...."I will continue to lead out in feeding the hungry, visiting the sick and infirm..."

Last week I was transported to the hospital because my physician said the results of my tests showed a "critical" and immediate need for Emergency Room care. This followed weeks of visits to a variety of doctors as well of becoming acquainted with oxygen machines and nebulators that severly limited not only my movement, but my hope for any future ministry in the Kingdom that I so enjoyed.

Fortunately my son lives with me and he was the one who took the call about the "critical" need for me to go to the hospital immediately. He wasted no time in getting the necessary tanks of oxygen and his mother (me) into the car and on the way to HealthPark Hospital. I'm not familiar with the general rules of some hospitals, but this one in particular did not allow visitors or even open door to rooms. I was isolated, lonely and confused (to say the least) since the severity of the diagnosis was not outwardly detectable or obvious to me in my day to day life.

But in the midst of my emotional misery and isolation, came a very special message from a very special minister, that brought a light into that room for which I will be forever grateful. Thank you, Wade, for hearing my sister, Sue, and ministering to me with a message love and compassion I've come to know you by and reminding me of the love of Christ.

I'm home now and can confirm that Wade does indeed practice what he preaches!

Thank you, Wade!

Wade Burleson said...

Victorous,

Oh my! LOVE THIS comment!

I just now connected that Victorious is you (Mary!) Wow! I had no idea. I've long appreciated "Victorious" comments. Our staff has been praying for you (Mary) since I received the message from your sister that you were critical and in ICU. I'm so glad that you were able to hear my Voice Mail in ICU. We still continue to pray for you, and you just made my day with your message!

SO GLAD to hear you are now home, Victorious!

The Lord's CONTINUED blessings to you and yours!

In Christ's Love,

Wade

Victorious said...

Wade, my sister (Sue) took your message from Voice Mail and put it on a very small tape recorder. Since the hospital doesn't allow visitors, she left the recorder (with your message) and instructions on how to work it for me....at the entrance to the hospital and the employees brought it to me in the room. I still have it here at home.

Sue knew I attended e-church and I often referred one of your blog posts for her to read so she knew your name and the respect I had for your.

We serve a miracle-working, God, do we not?

Wade Burleson said...

Victorious - we DO!

Amen!

Christiane said...

What is it that would make people feel 'free' again?
Is it that 'mandated' sheltering-in-place be stopped so that people can go out and live as 'normally' now?

What do people feel is threatening their freedom, Wade?
And when people talk of 'they' and 'the government', who specifically is being referred to?

What would help people to feel less troubled?

Wade, we all know your good heart. I see things differently on so many levels, and yet I do know that you are a deeply Christian man who serves God and those who are troubled with all your heart.

What is it that people are wanting to be done now? What changes would you like to see at this time that would make you feel better? No need to respond, it's just people are all very troubled now and it would be better if we could reach out and support one another in ways that are helpful. What changes do you see as critically important at this moment that would make things better is the question I would ask, if you cared to share your thoughts.

Christiane said...

Victorious,
I am glad to hear you are home from the hospital and that Wade's words ministered to you when you needed to hear them. May you be blessed and stay well.

Christiane said...

A prayer from another troubled time:

"O Lord, make haste and illumine the night. Say to my soul that nothing happens without You permitting it, and that nothing of what You permit is without comfort. O Jesus, Son of God, You Who were silent in the presence of Your accusers, restrain my tongue until I find what I should say and how to say it. Show me the way and make me ready to follow it. It is dangerous to delay, yet perilous to go forward. Answer my petition and show me the way. As the wounded go to the doctor in search of aid, so do I come to You. O Lord, give Your peace to my heart. Amen."

(Brigitta of Sweden, 13th-14th Century)

Tom said...

Wade,

I find it deeply saddening that the understand of the fundamentals of “Liberty, “Rights” and “Freedom,” is still poorly understood by many, even today. The United States Declaration of Independence did not give “liberty”, “rights” and “freedom” to all of the “citizens” living in the British controlled portion of the North American Continent at the time the British lost control over their citizens there. Slaves gained no “liberties”, “rights” or “freedom” with the declaration of the New Nation of the United States of America. That took another revolutionary war to establish some of their so called fundament liberties, rights and freedoms, but another 100 years or so passed before they were able to gain an equality with the people who had paid their way to come to the land willingly. They were punished for a crime that they did not commit when they were stolen, kidnapped, and traded, to become the property of their wealthy owners.

Little do people realise that the Liberties, Rights and Freedoms they enjoy are all enshrined within the governing statutes of the federation and states of the land they are presently living within.

People have the Privileges allowed by the law to own a gun, to work, to run a business and to drive a car today, within the boundaries of the respective state and federal laws which sets out their responsibilities associated with their respective, desired, privileges.
It is when people disconnect their responsibilities from their privileges, liberties and freedoms that anarchy is able to be establish within our respective societies.

In the speech, by Patrick Henry, you quoted in your blog, it raised a question in my mind as to what he meant by the phrase of the “God of Nature?” Was that Satan he was referring to event though he also suggested earlier in his speech that we also appeal to the “God of Hosts” for a solution to their dilemma at that time.

We are granted “rights” and “liberties” as allowed for within the law of the land, but our “freedom,” which has a “spiritual connection” with God, cannot be defined and bounded by the “law” of the land.

For me, my freedom is found within the boundaries of my relationship with God. It cannot be forcibly taken from me, but I can unwittingly give it over to Satan without knowing it.
The so-called Liberties and Rights I may enjoy within my community cannot constrain or remove my Freedom gained through my relationship with God. Others cannot constrain or remove my ability to worship God, wherever I may find myself to be or the circumstance that I might be found in, as my heart’s joy in God will naturally rise up and give effect to my desire to worship Him in all things and at all times.

Wade I note your application of Isaiah 58 and the promises that if we do His bidding and stop the pointing of the finger at each other that we will become like a perfumed garden where people naturally want to congregate in and around as God beauty is seen in His Saints fulfilling His purposes towards the people around them.

A time is coming soon when God will require all the Saints of God to keep His Sabbath Day of Resting in Him, Holy, as we set about making Kingdom disciples between now and the end of the age of the Ages.

May the Saints hear God’s voice and learn and know God’s purposes for each, and every Saint, as we each respond accordingly to His word.

Shalom

Rex Ray said...

Wade,

I’ll start with your last sentence: “…the loss of liberty is worse than death.”

That’s what the link below is about.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Masada

The Jews obeyed Elazar ben Yair, their leader, at Masada. They chose death over slavery and killed each other, including women and children.

Wade, you’re using the words of Patrick Henry the wrong way. He (and America) is willing to die FIGHTING for liberty but NOT to choose death.

You’re implying that by following ‘rules’ to prevent getting COVID-19 is losing our liberty.

Case in point: Today, my grandson was ‘broadsided’ by a man that ran a stop sigh. The man didn’t obey ‘rules’; he had ‘liberty’. Sounds crazy, huh? About as crazy as not following ‘rules’ to avoid the virus.

Today, at the VA, my doctor and I both wore masks. After I got home, I learned four of their workers have the virus. I had slid one hand along the hall to relive pain from a knee. I hope those workers hadn’t used the rail or the rails have been cleaned since they left.

Wade, I’ll tell you what more than once my father told me: “Rex, you’re always right, but when you’re wrong, you’re dead wrong.”

Wade Burleson said...

Rex,

I understand Henry would die "fighting." the British.

I'm drawing the parallel "get out of your homes, stop relying on the government, and FIGHT the Corona (masks, handwashing, distancing, etc...)"

At restaurants, hair salons, businesses, etc....

Fight it.

Rex Ray said...

Wade,

https://www.forbes.com/sites/shaharziv/2020/04/21/was-a-2000-stimulus-check-included-in-the-484-billion-senate-bill/#54b924f07253

“These payments, which the Treasury Department started disbursing last week to individuals who qualified, were a one-time remittance of:
• $1,200 for individuals
• $2,400 for married couples
• $500 for each dependent child 16-years-old or younger

My daughter told us today, that yesterday a large amount of money was put in their bank account from our government.

I’ve heard it said, “If the government has the right to give you money, it has the right to take it away.

Doug said...

Wade
I can't say how disappointed I am with your article. You are "comparing apples with oranges" and twisting logic to defend a certain (your) political stance. (Rex summarizes the problem with your logic in an earlier posting).
I wonder if you would stand by the bed side of a dying victim in the ER, reading Henry's essay. Or share it with our beleaguered doctors and nurses.
It all sounds like "noise" from behind the line of fire.
Would you be going on about our presumed loss of rights if it were (God forbid) your loved one on a ventilator?
I like an alcoholic drink (very) occasionally. It is my freedom to drink when I want and what I want. But I am willing to give up the right if I am going to be driving!
As a pastor I had hoped you might be encouraging us to stay in and to be willing to surrender our rights for a season as an act of brotherly love.
Time to get off your political "high horse".

Ruth Ann Miles said...

My husband sent this link to me. My son is currently working on his Citizenship in the Nation badge for the Boy Scouts. One of the requirements is to read and analyze how a famous speech is relevant to when it was written and if it is still relevant to today. I am a direct descendant of Patrick Henry on my mother's side; naturally I chose this speech that your blog is about. I gave my son a brief description of the circumstances to March 23, 1775 and read the speech to him (his sisters are part of this history lesson as well). Then I read the blog and the rewritten speech by Wade Burleson. He sits to write his thoughts for his merit badge. Following is the last line of his thoughts to answer the question of how Patrick Henry's speech applies to today: "I don't want America to fall. We are the United States, not the Divided States. We stand together, not apart." - Lance, age 14

Wade Burleson said...

Ruth Ann -

That is so cool! I had not idea of your connection with Patrick Henry! Wishing Lance the best!

Wade Burleson said...

Doug,

Thanks for your comment. I appreciate you are disappointed with my writing. Get in line! (I say that respectfully). If I wrote for popularity rather than principle, I'd be out of my mind. I write because I believe certain things, not because I want people to not be disappointed in me.

That said, this isn't political - it's principled.

Our GOVERNOR OPENED OKAHOMA today.

I chose to keep our church closed for the foreseeable future.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it! Laughing. I only want freedom to make the choice myself and not have intervention of the state.

Tom said...

Doug,

It seems to me that you are confusing your ability to freely choose to drink alcoholic beverages when and if you want to, with your "freedom." Being able to drink an alcoholic beverage is a liberty that the law allows you, but that liberty is confined within the guidelines as set out in the Law.

The problem today is that people believe that their "freedom" allows them to do whatever they like without regards to the consequences that follow on from exercising their so called "freedom" of free choice. The reality is that people are selfishly choosing what they want to do without considering the flow on effects of the choices they make.

Unless you are prepared to die for what you believe, we have no belief in it.

As a general rule people are afraid of dying and as such they will comply with the Governmental directive if they perceive there is a direct benefit for them. If they do not perceive a beneficial outcome for themselves, then they will ignore the directive from the Government and simple chose to do their own thing which is often a moderate form of anarchy that can develop into full blown anarchism within the wider community.

All of this depends on our understanding of the fundamental concepts that are enshrined within the established "laws" of God's earth in which we can live.

Shalom

Christiane said...

the day grows late and it is getting dark

JESUS CHRIST STAY WITH US

in place of our anxiety, give us Your peace

JESUS CHRIST HEAL US

Doug said...

Wade
I should have given some context to my disappointment with your article. I have followed your blog for more than 10 years. Although I don't always agree with you (that is OK) I almost always admire your power to reason and think critically, and that you are willing to go against the "popular" line when your principles lead you there (e.g. woman in ministry). I am disappointed that, in my humble opinion, your reasoning here is not sound and that, it seems to me, you are twisting logic to fit your political stance ("libertarian" according to an earlier post), instead of allowing reason and critical thinking to lead you to a conclusion. Since you are "libertarian" (a meaningless word if I every heard one) I can assume you will be sending back your recent windfall from the government. If you do, please direct it to someone in need!

Wade Burleson said...

Doug,

Your explanation helps me understand from whence you come in terms of perspective. Thank you.

Christiane said...

I was thinking about how the Disciples gathered together as they were instructed to do so to await the coming of the Holy Spirit, as we now await the feast of the Celebration of Pentecost on May 31st.

They sheltered together. And they awaited the promise.

Luke 24:49
"And behold, I am sending the promise of My Father upon you.
But remain in the city until you have been clothed with power from on high."

And, in time, the Holy Spirit descended

Sometimes, as Christian people we wait in sheltered rooms, and sometimes we 'go forth' without fear; and as in the days of the Apostles, we are always in the keeping of the Lord lest we forget. We pray for wisdom for the days ahead. At least, let us do no harm.

bunkababy said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
bunkababy said...

just gotta roll my eyes at that blog post.

My liberties are being salvaged and valued by all of us in Canada using our liberties to stay home, stay sheltered and do what our government suggests. My liberty is being protected by those doing the same so we all can have a chance to stay healthy until a vaccine or immunities can protect our body.

This liberty that American's hang their hat on was a threat by man, not disease.

I don't think the majority of Canadian's feel threatened by our government doing all they can in their power to protect us as a country, as individuals feel threatened whatsoever.

I know from reading and speaking to people we feel protected, cared for by our government and individuals because we are staying home, because our government is suggesting things for our own good and we are responding positively because of it.

There might be some rogue people out there who might think different but I know collectively as Canadian's there has never been a time where we feel more unified than now.

WE have leadership we elected in place to do what is necessary for us. To feel threatened by that seems absurd.

This liberty thing in the USA is working against her people not for her people. Your liberties that are so prized have become your own threat, your own war to her people.


To me it is nothing more than being selfish. It has been warped and twisted and far from the original threat that it was put in place for. This virus doesn't care about your liberties, it will strip you bare, ravage your organs, and kill you and your fellow American's and all you people can do is worry about whether or not your government is threatening your liberties.


Ridiculous post.

Anonymous said...

"This respiratory doctor also exposes the COVID-19 test itself as useless. It is not testing for the virus but rather the reaction to the virus. Since it is a PCR test and not the gold standard of isolation and purification etc. (Koch’s postulates discussed here), it is merely testing for RNA sequences that could be caused by many other things, not a dreaded new coronavirus strain."

Transcript here of this doc's perspective: https://www.globalresearch.ca/respiratory-doctor-exposes-fake-virus-pandemic/5710274

The fact that these vids from Youtube are getting pulled quickly is pretty indicative they don't want the truth to get out.

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2020/04/jim-quinn/burning-down-the-house/

"We are plunging towards our rendezvous with destiny. The powers that be will shortly be in the cover-up phase of this overblown fake emergency. What they have done to fend off a nasty virus is preposterous and asinine. It’s like burning down a building occupied by 200 people to possibly save 1 person. And there is no proof burning down the building actually prevented the 1 person from dying.

Precautions taken by individuals with the highest risk, specifically protecting those in nursing homes, and allowing businesses to enact reasonable safety measures for their employees and customers, while the general population developed a herd immunity to this virus, would have resulted in a similar mortality outcome without creating a 2nd Great Depression. Sweden has proved this was the rational course of action. No government solutions, implemented with sledgehammers by authoritarian governors as we are experiencing today, should have been employed. The government at all levels acts as a hammer, and we are all nails to these power hungry drones."

Ken

Lee Enochs said...

Pastor Wade. This is an excellent post. Liberty is under seige here in America and if you think you have it bad in Oklahoma, try living here in liberal California under Gavin Newsom's ridiculous quarantine where the state is arresting surfers and people watching the sun go down at the beach but releasing violent criminals back on the streets.

Anonymous said...

we ask the eternal questions

"and who is my neighbor?"



" and who’ll be kind enough to measure
our words and deeds as we intend?”
(Alexander Pushkin)

Rex Ray said...

Wade,

You said, “Our GOVERNOR OPENED OKAHOMA today.”

I failed to find the above on Google, but found this link:

https://www.livescience.com/oklahoma-coronavirus-updates.html

“Latest updates:— On Monday (April 20) a federal judge ordered that all abortion procedures can resume in Oklahoma, effective Friday. Governor Kevin Stitt previously included abortions in his ban on minor medical procedures and elective surgeries, The Oklahoman reported. The temporary ban included pill-based abortions, even though those procedures do not impact the number of available hospital beds for COVID-19 patients, which governor Stitt claimed was the point of the executive order.”

RB Kuter said...

So, Wade, maybe I missed it but wondering what your point is and how it applies to today's situation?

I am guessing that your post is meant to be a warning that the government could impose inappropriate restrictions on our lives but that sometimes we must submit due to the government's application of authority being necessary for the welfare of the majority. Not sure. Could you simplify it for the sake of we more slow-minded?

Anonymous said...

we are all trying to work this out

maybe if we compared what we thought about instead of attacking one another's ideas, we might see farther ahead?

it's worth a try

like that young man, Ruth Ann Miles' son wrote " "I don't want America to fall. We are the United States, not the Divided States. We stand together, not apart." - Lance, age 14

there is a principle called 'synergy' where people get together and contribute to a project and somehow, out the efforts of all together, comes a result that is greater than the sum of its parts

in the Body of Christ, this happens collegially - 'synergy on steroids' :)
The collective wisdom of a people may not be always a 'debate' with a 'winner' and a 'loser', no;
sometimes in the Body of Christ, among people of good will, a collective wisdom of sorts can emerge, something no one individually could come up with, but something 'more'

Rex Ray said...

Wade,

Well, old friend, have you every admitted you’ve been wrong on any of your post in ten years?

It looks like to me; the statements below show the Governor of Oklahoma is happy to give up liberty to keep from dying. (Just one more person that disagrees with your post.)

The same link states:

On Friday, the state Department of Health announced that the pandemic is predicted to peak in Oklahoma on April 21, with a death toll close to 500 by the start of May. "This model assumes continued compliance with social distancing practices by the Oklahoma population through May 1," the Health Department said.

In a news conference on Tuesday (April 7) governor Stitt said he is "cautiously optimistic" that the rate of COVID-19-related hospitalizations is starting to flatten.

"Yesterday afternoon, we had 407 patients in hospitals across Oklahoma with COVID or COVID-like symptoms. Last Monday, we had 560," Stitt said. "We are seeing proof here in Oklahoma and across the country that our SOCIAL DISTANCING IS WORKING."

On Wednesday (April 1) governor Stitt extended his executive order closing all "non-essential" businesses to cover all 77 Oklahoma counties. Businesses must remain closed through April 30, the governor announces.

Governor Stitt previously enacted a "safer-at-home" policy to mandate the state's vulnerable populations (including elderly citizens as well as citizens with autoimmune disorders) to remain at home except for essential travel to the grocery store or pharmacy. Stitt is asking those citizens to self-isolate until April 30.

My previous comment stated: “On Monday (April 20) a federal judge ordered that all abortion procedures can resume in Oklahoma.”

I wonder if many years ago, there had been Abortion Clinics, and a young un-wed girl had her baby aborted, Jesus may have never been born.

RB Kuter,
You’re anything but “slow minded”. :)

Rex Ray said...

Yeah, I know that’s a crazy statement, but that’s the way I feel about murdering babies!

Wade Burleson said...

RB Kuter, you ask, "I am guessing that your post is meant to be a warning that the government could impose inappropriate restrictions on our lives but that sometimes we must submit due to the government's application of authority being necessary for the welfare of the majority. Not sure. Could you simplify it for the sake of we more slow-minded?"

I agree with Rex, you are not slow-minded. That said, both you and Rex are missing my point.

Since the people of the United States "are the government" if WE THE PEOPLE determine that we wish to keep their private businesses open, wish to leave their homes, and wish to continue the natural course of their business, GOVERNMENT ENCROACHMENT through forcible shuttering of businesses, lockdown in homes with threat of arrest, and other unconstitutional overreaches will ultimately destroy our Republic and take us down the path of tyranny.

I'm sorry for not being clear.

Christiane said...

I do know that under no ORDINARY circumstances would people in our country accept the present restrictions on activities.

But I can advise from what my family is telling me that these are difficult days for many in the country, though, thank God, some areas have not suffered as other areas have, and we are all grateful for this.

But these 'difficult days' for the ones who have suffered intently are not 'ordinary' days, no, and having not had to deal with something so strange as this virus and how it so easily is passed from one to another, and how virulently it takes down some of our population that are vulnerable,
it might be better to say that 'government' has tried to do what it thought was right in response to a reality, not to some 'made-up hoax', so some leaders have chosen to try to save lives by imposing restrictions.

People must do what they think is right according to their consciences, but the truth is, we are in uncharted waters and most people in this country are people of good will. Have mistakes been made? Sure. But I do think the virus is deadly for the most vulnerable of our citizens, and the medical folk in my family tell me that it is not an 'easy' death.

We need to get away from conspiracy theories and focus on facts and statistics. We need to realize that one of the main ways in which our country HAS been attacked (from without and within) is that forces have tried to divide us and turn us against each other. So, when I read the words of that young MAN (age 14), Ruth Ann Miles' son Lance, who wrote " "I don't want America to fall. We are the United States, not the Divided States. We stand together, not apart." I thought:
sometimes we can learn wisdom from those who will inherit our nation in time and take their place to be responsible citizens and this young man has written words of wisdom in the middle of a difficult time in a way that is encouraging and strengthening.

I would like to thank the young man for his words, and his good mother for sharing them. His voice is not a voice of division or impatience or fear, but of hope and we are lucky to have his words to read now. My own son is a Coast Guard officer now, but when I read Lance's words, I thought of my son at that age. It was a good memory.

We need to listen to voices of reason, and if a 14-year old boy says it best of all, I'd like to stand up and give him credit for this gift of patriotic affirmation and encouragement.

Anonymous said...

Wade, you have known for years I tend to speak my mind.

You cannot fix stupid. And your post is stupid.

Last night a dear family member of ours, a paramedic, went into harms way to help a person determined to exercise his freedom and travel from a hot spot to cross this great nation of ours. Now we may indeed lose a loved one for the sake of someone's "freedom" since there is reason to believe the person had covid19.

You want to help people? There are plenty of ways to help without breaking any health and safety rules. I suggest maybe what you exhibit now is hubris, plain and simple. You know better than the WHO, the CDC, the FDA, the state and local health depts., and probably your own physician?

No, we do not need lockdowns forever. And yes, there is wise opening that can be done WHEN WE HAVE ENOUGH TESTS AND CONTACT TRACING IN PLACE.

But idiots running around "feeling healthy" may be the worst spreaders of this nasty disease. And it is not just the elderly and the sick dying. Keep up. Children, teens, and healthy adults with no preexisting conditions are dying also.

You are fighting a battle here that is just hurtful, harmful, and insane. It is like fighting back at the firefighters trying to save you from a burning building.

I posit you do not like being shelved for the time being, maybe even are craving the limelight and in your own mind finding an enemy that does not exist.

I serve a Lord that yes, tells us to take care of the least of these. But He also says not to toot our own horn when we do. How about LEADING by being truly Reformed and obeying the magistrates?!

Please ya'll, stop putting my kid's life in danger because you are bored at home! We will lose far more jobs, churches, money, whatever if we force an early and hard second peak now. Listen to the real experts, not Wade on this one.

We cannot fix stupid, we are in a hard fight, this is not going to be a quick fix and back to normal. We seem to be in a time where God is giving us a hard reset, changing systems and ending them much like the fall of Jerusalem.

Be smart. Wear a mask, social distance, stay out of hair salons and barber shops and skin art businesses. Shop only when you must and then use delivery or curbside delivery. Stay out of church buildings!! Go to church online, or use zoom, or have parking lot church with the windows closed, or revive the home altar.

Only a bunch of babies starts whining in the middle of the battlefield that it is no fair and too tough. Cowboy up.

Wade, with this post you reallllllyyyy blew it!

linda

Anonymous said...

" Listen to the real experts, not Wade on this one."

Linda, why are there so many experts that have courage coming forward to call out the GOV experts on their extremely inflated projections, highly inaccurate tests, inaccurate mortality counts, etc.? Are you even reading any of the links I'm posting for perspective?

Like this latest doc: https://www.globalresearch.ca/de-mystifying-statistics-muddled-clear-headed-thinking-leaders-need-during-times-crisis/5710544

"Please pay attention to the following statistical facts that contradict what is being propagandized on every media outlet, including television, radio and national, regional and local print media:

As just one example, it must be noted that only 0.1% of the population of China ever got COVID, despite well-propagandized media reports that successfully made most of us think that the entire population of China was at risk.

The assortment of statistics concerning the risks of actually getting COVID as of mid-April are far less that the 1 out of a 100 (as heralded by the media), which if true might even make me concerned. Hint: The risks are far, far less."

"Truth is the most precious thing. That's why we should ration it." Vladimir Lenin


People are seeing the foolishness of being mesmerized and controlled by those in white coats holding authoritative positions, and are starting to confront those who willingly do the dirty work of tyrants.

Response after mother was arrested for playing with children in a closed park:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ozcDRIjVJos

Skid to 8:50 mark to see how officer answers his question. I speak with people routinely across the country who feel the same way as the guy who asked the question. Policing for profit. DOT has crippled the shipping industry by over regulating it for many years. Too many farmers, contractors, shippers ending up with heavy fines and closing business for good.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aRCUrccxhvg


ken

RB Kuter said...

Thank you, Wade, for taking the extra effort to clarify to me the intent of your message. I believe that is what I concluded from it but appreciate the confirmation.

I am VERY disturbed about this entire "pandemic panic" and the media/political hype associated with it. There is a tremendous amount of "misinformation" causing a very ambiguous situation to be even more susceptible to skepticism.

For example, I have found no data or proposals by the expert scientists involved that the "Corona Virus" is any more deadly than the common flu which we had in the 2019-2020 flu season in the US "prior to the COVID-19" frenzy. Prior to February 2020 CDC reported there were over 200,000 flu cases in the US with more than 20,000 death associated with the flu! Yet there was NO media focus or even notice until the COVID 19 label was attached to it.

Our local newspaper reported this week that rest home facility directors were saying that state level reports were greatly exaggerating the numbers of cases of COVID-19 in their rest homes for the elderly. Ministers in our church of 2,000 say there have been no members to their knowledge who have contracted "COVID-19".

There was no discussion about shutting down society, imposing "shelter in place", or "testing of those not going to the doctor with flu symptoms during the midst of the "flu season" when we had 200,000 cases of the anonymous "flu". We continued to have church, Bible studies, went to work, and had no shortages of anything. Virtually EVERYONE was working and the economy was going gangbusters! Protests continued in Hong Kong and all the while people around us were coming down with "the flu" just like they do EVERY flu season!

There will be no "black death" type plague when we return to the life we had during the flu season when life was going on as normal. We will return to the normalcy of when we continue to have colds, flu, pneumonia and all sorts of contagious disease and people will continue to die. It will be that way until Jesus returns.

When somebody comes down with the flu during ANY "flu season", they stay at home until they get well. Those who did come into contact with them prior to their getting so sick they had to stay at home are susceptible to contracting their flu. When someone sits behind you in the choir with a bad cold you go home figuring you are quite susceptible to catching it and wish they had used common sense and stayed home! We take tons of Vitamin C and Zinc but we don't crawl in holes and eat grass to isolate ourselves.

Politics, domestic and international, figure into the mix. Players with a lot at stake like the WHO, Communist Chinese regime, those pushing for open borders and globalization in Europe and the US, all figure into the mix and are loving the control and domination central governments are having through all of this. They would love for it to continue on forever, especially through this US election season.

We'll never know what was the truth. All we can do is to maintain a logical, objective, rational perspective which includes awareness that politicians who run government worldwide have their own motives which most often conflict with the interests of the common man and woman citizen.

Perhaps this is only a taste of what follows as we continue to move forward in God's planned conclusion to this dispensation.

Christiane said...

Dear people,

yesterday my 82 year old husband was taken by ambulance to hospital with what we thought were stroke symptoms,
but it's much worse. He is unconscious now on a ventilator and the prognosis is poor for him.
A test was done for the virus, but it turned out negative. The problem(s) are metastasized cancer affecting lower brain stem and spinal cord, he coded twice in ER and was brought back and put on the ventilator. My son arrives tonight from Alaska. I am asking for prayers for my husband as I seek God's will and want for him to have a chance if at all possible to be with us a little longer. Please pray and thank you all. God Bless!

Christiane

RB Kuter said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
RB Kuter said...

Let's keep things within a fact-based perspective. Based upon CDC Flu Cases/Deaths in USA in past 3 flu seasons:

2018-19 USA FLU CASES: 35.5 MILLION
HOSPITALIZED: 490,600
ASSOC DEATHS: 34,200


2017-18 USA FLU CASES: 45 MILLION
HOSPITALIZED: 810,000
ASSOC DEATHS: 61,000

2016-17 USA FLU CASES: 29 MILLION
HOSPITALIZED: 500,000
DEATHS: 38,000

CORONA VIRUS A/O TODAY (APRIL 14)
USA: HOSPITALIZED: 890,000
DEATHS: 50,272

WORLD: HOSPITALIZED 2,729,274
DEATHS: 191,614

Interesting that reports say that the USA has 26% of the world's number of deaths and 33% of the world's cases.

Based on reports of all sorts of causes of death being associated with the "Corona Virus", it should cause pause in responding to the hype, politicization, and hidden motives.

Could be cause for genuine concern, but interesting that no calls were made for shelter in place, $2 TRILLION bogus spending bill, shut down of economy.

Could it have anything to do with China's desire to squelch protests?
Iran's?
Leftist-Elitists in USA seeking to sabotage election process in USA?

At least should raise questions.

Hongbi said...

Christiane, I am praying for your husband and for all of your family. I'm giving God thanks and praise that ambulance and emergency services were/are available for him. His circumstances sound desperate, probably more so than the COVID patients that are receiving all of today's attention. May the Lord deliver him through this and keep you safe in His peace.

Re: post. It's one thing to have state governors recommending restrictions on outdoor gatherings and unnecessary travel in order to slow the spread of an uber-contagious virus. Quite another for a governor (hello, Michigan) to declare store merchandise as essential or non-essential. That's worse than paternalism or Big Brother, that's a governor assuming the role of God. Wrong answer.

I initially gave our governmental authorities the benefit of the doubt in deciding how to protect their citizens, and I definitely appreciate President Trump delegating authority from the White House down to the state level when it makes sense to do so. However, now we've got state leaders that are imposing their will on us to the detriment of liberty and self-determination. Some leaders are more interested in keeping us dependent on government stimulus funds than they are in stimulating businesses back into operation. Wrong again.

Rex Ray said...

Dear sweet CHRISTIANE,

I was thinking of two funny stories I’d plan to tell you until I read the tragic news about your husband a few minutes ago. I’m praying your husband will be with you a long time. What’s his name? I’m glad your son has come.