"I went to Jerusalem to become acquainted (Gk. istoria) with Cephas" - Paul's words from Galatians 1:18.

Up For Another Challenge: My 2009 Predictions

(1). The first real challenge for Barack Obama will come not from the Arab world, but from Russia.

For the past decade, with little fanfare from the west, Russia's government has gone underground in terms of her security forces' activies, her desire to arm Iran in that country's attempt to wipe out Israel, and her efforts to expand modern Russia's land mass (including the land under the melting ice of the Northwest Passage). Russian government leaders are already rattling their sabers at Obama over missiles in Europe, reminding those old enough to remember of Russia's battle with the John Kennedy administration during the Cuban missile crises of 1962.

(2). The attendance for the Southern Baptist Convention in Louisville, Kentucky will be the lowest for Southern Baptists since the late 1800's.

If ever there was a time to redefine who we Southern Baptists are, refocus on what we Southern Baptists should be doing, and re-energize tens of thousands of American young people who have spiritually awakened to the things of Christ - it is now. No better time to reorganize than when we have as few people attending the SBC as we did in the century in which the SBC was formed.

(3). The price of oil will settle in the summer of 2009 around the $75 to $80 dollar a barrel figure.

That means gas will average $2.50 to $2.75 a gallon by fall 2009.

(4). By the fall of 2009, the recession will show signs of ending, with an even worse economic problem looming - inflation, then hyper-inflation.

My Keynsian economics professors who provided for me my liberal finance education, actually turned me into a conservative economist by their off the wall statements in class, including this one: Government should never worry about deficits. All they have to do is print money.

Seems like Congress attended the same classes I did. The government bail outs of private industry, intended to provide economic stimili, in reality forces government to turn on the printing presses to cover government deficits. When that happens, the value of the dollar plummets, not just a little, but drastically.

Hyper-inflation has a track record. Every country that turned on the printing presses, including 1920's Germany, various 20th Century African republics, and several South American banana republics, found their people carting wheel barrows of cash into the grocery store to buy a loaf of bread. Hyper-inflation wipes out savings, crashes all stock investments and the stock market itself, and moves a country back to either bartering for goods or toward a precious metals standard of exchange in order to stabilize the economy. When our government confiscated all the gold and issued currency without precious metal backing decades ago, we were warned that the system would work as long as people had trust in the paper (might I add "worthless) issued by the government.

That day of trust is quickly coming to an end.

(5). The Texas Longhorns will face an NCAA probe into the recruitment of defensive tackle JaMarkus McFarland

The New York Times wrote a devasting article about the activities of some Texas boosters who attempted to coerce McFarland to sign with Texas. McFarland and his mother stood by their allegations of money being offered by Texas alumni (no coaches were involved).

(6). The OU vs. Texas football game in October of 2009 will be the most highly charged, electric atmospheres of any regular season college football game in 2009.

Bradford and McCoy will both be back. OU will be defending national champions. Both teams will be undefeated. The McFarland recruitment scandle will only worsen. There will be several scores to settle.

(7). The new movement within evangelicalism will be away from mega-buildings, mega-budgets, and mega-satellite churches that focus on electronics and media, to local congregations renting facilities, more emphasis on the preaching of the word, and missions (both local and international). We evangelical Christians will again remember that it is the preaching of the word of God that transforms souls.

Maybe this is a hope, not a prediction.

(8). The most anticipated comedy in decades will be This Side of the Truth, though this is one movie that I will refuse to see in 2009 because of the blasphemous, anti-Christ statements of its creator, the athiest Ricky Gervais (co-creator of "The Office").

I don't mind atheists. I don't even mind seeing movies made by atheists. I just don't wish to put money in the pockets of anyone who intentionally seeks to mock Jesus Christ in his public statements.

(9). I will get more email about William Paul Young, author of "The Shack," and his speaking at Emmanuel April 3-4, 2009 than any other event in 2009.

Before you write me, read number eight again. (smile).

(10). I will do better in my 2009 predictions than I did my 2008 predictions

In His Grace,

Wade Burleson


Glen Alan Woods said...

That explains why the Christmas episode of the Office featured a character shoving the nativity scene, especially the baby Jesus, into a desk drawer.

Are you going to be featuring the William Paul Young event on video via the web?

Joe Blackmon said...

"OU will be defending national champions."

Dude, I think you've got a typo in there. You mean to add "I hope that..." at the beginning of the sentance. Three letters for you--SEC. And I ain't talking about the Securities and Exchange Commission.

I don't know what planet Tim Tebow comes from but they must play good football there.

I'm just sayin'....

Wade Burleson said...

We Shall See Joe,

The post is one of predictions, not hope.


Wade Burleson said...

Glen Alan Woods,

We will ask permission to broadcast live. I'm not sure if we will be allowed.

bryan riley said...

I too hope that your prediction regarding churches will be true, Wade. It really must be so!

bryan riley said...

If we are in the country in April, we will be there for Young. I saw him in Atlanta at Catalyst and he was fantastic. What an amazing book and what a humble, God-fearing man.

Kevin M. Crowder said...


What is your opinion of Dr. Mohler's review of the book (The Shack)? Do you endorse the book? Or can you point me to a place where you have already addressed this?

Obviously none of us thinks of the persons of the trinity in the manner in which Young personifies them. I am curious to know his purpose for writing such a tale. But at the end of the day, it’s a book. I have been criticized for liking the Harry Potter series. But other than that I do not read for fun so to speak. I read for shear knowledge. What knowledge could I gain from reading The Shack?

Prediction #1 Sounds like you been watchin' too much Jack Van Impe.......but sadly you may be right.

As for Louisville 09, I predict 12k in attendance as the Calvinist Predestined Panthers head to Mecca and kick butt over the favored Arminian Hairy Tics. I also predict that Hunt will break the Hobbs all-time greatest jeer record for loudest "boo" to a single man.


Anonymous said...


Did you know that your hero, Mohler, attends an Arminian seeker mega church?


Anonymous said...

"Did you know that your hero, Mohler, attends an Arminian seeker mega church?"

Do you know why Lydia? What if I told you it is because he seeks to exemplify cooperation and not let his personal view of the Calvinism debate distract from said cooperation.

But alas, you will not have it will you Lydia? It seems you are intent on even destroying that.

Are you sure you want to participate on Wade's blog? You are going directly against the very thing he blogs about. Cooperation! Working and even worshipping together -gasp!-despite certain differences.

I suspect you would not respect Mohler even if he went to First Calvinistic No Free Willies Allowed Baptist Church. You would still find something about him to hate and cause DIS-cooperation.

Let me guess. That's just the kind of christian you are, right?

Just as it was for your namesake in scripture, may your heart be changed as well.

Rex Ray said...

“The criterion by which the Bible is to be interpreted is Jesus Christ” was removed from the BFM 1963.

Al Mohler explained why: “They [conservatives] believed in priesthood of BELIEVERS but not priesthood of BELIEVER because it leaves too much freedom for the individual.”

Until Mohler retracts his statement, Christians should keep both eyes open.

NativeVermonter said...

Let us not forget that in 2009 Christians will still be apathetic about the gift of life and still do nothing in helping folks actually...live.

It's unfortunate when unbelievers lead in compassion.

Anonymous said...

Hi Rex,

I'm not sure what it "makes me" but I think I agree more with the statement "Priesthood of the Believers" than I do "Priesthood of the Believer".

I'm hoping that makes me a Christian. :) (Just kidding.)

I'm also sure it's not correct to have an "anything goes" theology or religion. Hence the words that might seem to restrict freedom a bit.

Now I'm certain you disagree with everything I just wrote but I would still be glad to hear your thoughts.

Just don't ask me a bunch of questions. :)

Thanks. Appreciate you.


Gene Prescott said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Gene Prescott said...

Regarding prediction # 4 I'm inclined, in general, to agree with economist Scott Grannis:


Anonymous said...

"What if I told you it is because he seeks to exemplify cooperation and not let his personal view of the Calvinism debate distract from said cooperation."

Is that what it is? Hmmm. That is strange. Then why the dogmatism at SBTS? Especially about women and ESS. It is confusing.

But, I think you gave a very good PR answer.


davidbmclaughlin.com said...

Will both Young services be similar or are they different formats. I am planning on attending and wondered if I need to try for both.

David Mc

What you can learn from the Shack is a beautiful picture of the love that God has for his children. There is plenty to disagree with. I disagree with some of it myself (pg 182)but I don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.


Scott Shaffer said...


Why do you think Mohler attends an "Arminian seeker mega church"?

Wade Burleson said...

David, we are working on the schedule and will let you know.

Kevin M. Crowder said...

I do not know the true dynamic of Highview Baptist Church in Louisville, Ky. But, to classify it as an Arminian church is not accurate. Dr. Ezell I understand is not a 5 point Calvinist, but I doubt he considers himself an historic Arminianist. Additionally, Dr. Ezell has hired Dr. Moore (a 5 pointer) as one of his teaching pastors at the Fegenbush Campus, additionally much of the staff are graduates of Southern Seminary. With Dr. Mohler as one of their coveted SS teachers, I am certain that a Calvinist would feel right at home at Highview. On the other hand, the President of the Southern Baptist Convention, (The Honorary Dr.) Johnny Hunt FIRED a staff member for being a Calvinist. "I am the Pastor of this church" he says..."and what I believe is what my staff will believe."

Sound Pattersonian?

As for the mega church claim? Sure Highview is a big church, but I am impressed with their multi-campus strategy--growing the Kingdom without the Crystal Cathedral effect.

Happy New Year!


RM said...

As much as I love and appreciate all you do, why is that you Sooners always want to try to get a recruitment scandal going with UT. Seems like the book on that issue was written in Norman.

Jeff said...

As to prediction # 7--Amen. Here is a link to a story that contains one of the boldest moves I've ever seen in ministry: http://www.christianindex.org/5010.article

Anonymous said...

"Additionally, Dr. Ezell has hired Dr. Moore (a 5 pointer) as one of his teaching pastors at the Fegenbush Campus"

Russell Moore? Did he give up his job at SBTS to be a teaching pastor there? Or is this just supplementing that salary? I wonder if he teaches that comps are wimps at Highview.

I am quite familiar with the Highview tactics of taking over small churches.


Kevin M. Crowder said...

"I am quite familiar with the Highview tactics of taking over small churches. "

I am not. Please explain. (Unless by that you mean planting a gifted young minister and supporting him financially) That is a GOOD thing.

Anonymous said...

Good Morning, Everyone

It's me, L's

Some thoughts and scripture and prayer for the New Year:

Our lives are made of days and nights,
of seasons and years,
for we are part of a universe of suns and moons and planets.
We mark ends and we make beginnings
and, in all, we praise God
for the grace and mercy
that fill our days.

It is written in the book of Genesis (Genesis 1:14-19):

God said:
"Let there be lights in the dome of the sky, to separate day from night. L
et them mark the fixed times, the days and the years, and serve as luminaries in the dome of the sky, to shed light upon the earth."

And so it happened: God made the two great lights, the greater one to govern the day, and the lesser one to govern the night; and he made the stars. God set them in the dome of the sky, to shed light upon the earth, to govern the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness. God saw how good it was. Evening came, and morning followed—the fourth day.

Remember us, 0 God; from age to age be our comforter. You have given us the wonder of time, blessings in days and nights, seasons and years.

Bless your children at the turning of the year and fill the months ahead with the bright hope that is ours in the coming of Christ.

Lord Jesus, come quickly.


NativeVermonter said...


I see nothing "bold" about that article, I simply see Christians who desire to serve their Lord and to be good stewards of His gifts. Nothing bold at all...it's just Christian.

In fact, some have been doing that for quite some time already. I appreciate the link as it serves as an encouragment.


Rex Ray said...

You have a good attitude that I like.

Mohler went on to say, “Conservatives are the party of truth while the moderates are the party of freedom.”

Since Jesus said you will know the truth and the truth will set you free; HOW IN THE WORLD does a Christian know truth without freedom?

I’ll admit ‘Priesthood of the Believers’ sounds good, but it has a ‘hook’ in it. The ‘hook’ is it is used as ‘top down rule’. It’s turning Baptists into Catholics.

At Calvary, the torn curtain symbolized the INDIVIDUAL has freedom to go to God. The Holy Spirit has been given to individuals—not a group or a committee. Each of us has become our ‘own priest’.

Starting with Paul and ending with many missionaries using their individual priesthood to do mission, much could be said. But I’ll give examples of how ‘Priesthood of the Believers’ has been used.

On a return trip to the Baptist Village in Israel, I talked with a previous auto-mechanic employee. He was unhappy and said he loved working on cars but if he had not agreed to be trained for a desk job, he would have been fired.

I told him I knew what he was talking about. He replied, “What have they done to you?”

The group (Priesthood of Believers) hired the man’s father to replace him.

Another example: The group leader told a missionary couple, “Tonight, I’ll pray, and tomorrow, I’ll tell you what God’s will is for your lives.”

“They sneaked in [BFM 2000 kept in secret before voting] to spy on us [Baptist KGB] and take away the FREEDOM we have in Christ Jesus. They wanted to enslave us and force us [sign BFM] to follow their Jewish [IMB] regulations.” (Galatians 2:4 NLT)

Our church has not had bylaws in its history of sixty plus years, and we’re busy working on some. Our pastor says he is not a CEO, and we want to make sure our bylaws keep it that way.

SLIM, thanks for saying hi, and you’ll notice—no questions. Smile

Anonymous said...

"I’ll admit ‘Priesthood of the Believers’ sounds good, but it has a ‘hook’ in it. The ‘hook’ is it is used as ‘top down rule’. It’s turning Baptists into Catholics."

Rex, That added 's' becomes very significant when one considers what SBTS is now teaching about the eternal subordination of Jesus Christ within the Trinity...The Lord of Hosts.

It is not just about hierarchy, it is getting too close to JW and/or Mormon doctrine for me where Jesus Christ, the Lord of Hosts is presented as a 'lesser' Deity by these folks.

I am starting to see why Mohler pressed so hard for that 's'. He really wanted to take "Priesthood" out of the BF&M according to some accounts from folks there. But at least he got the 's'. Which is a start down the same road.


Anonymous said...

I am not. Please explain. (Unless by that you mean planting a gifted young minister and supporting him financially) That is a GOOD thing.

Thu Jan 01, 01:12:00 PM 2009

Kevin, Gifted can mean many things to people. But instead of hijacking this thread, I hope that some who were personally involved in the Highview takeover of Valley Station Baptist church will decide to go public and put some of the facts and even the corresspondance on the internet.

But then, you would probably agree with the tactics because these men are your heros.


Jack Maddox said...

I predict that Lydia and many like her will continue to become even more and more bitter and antagonistic against all things SBC. I also predict that my friend Wade will continue to facilitate any and every opportunity for her to do so.


Jeff said...


FYI, I love Vermont. Did a weekend for a church in Plainfield and stayed in Barre.

I would agree that what Rolling Hills did is "just Christian." However, if you've not lived in this "southern culture" you may not recognize this as being "bold" in the sense that I do.

I'm involved in a new church plant here in South Georgia; www.journeychurchga.com. There is a lot of excitement in the area--except from most other existing churches! Seems everyone loves church planting except in their backyard. Anyway, I was in a car dealership speaking with one of the salespersons. She was very enthused about the new work and then asked, "Where are you going to build the church? Will it be here in town?"

I proceeded to tell her we would not be building anything in the forseeable future because we wanted to be the church--not a building called one. She looked at me like I was from another planet. I'm sure that's not just a southern culture phenomenon, but putting your church buildings up for sale in this culture so that you can do ministry is in this part of the world...odd, to say the least. And doing it in this culture with a large existing baptist church...well, bold is how I would define the leadership, and Christlike is how I would define their heart.

Have a great new year!

Kevin M. Crowder said...

I know that sheep need a shepherd. Without one, they will graze themselves right off a cliff.

That I do know.


Kevin M. Crowder said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

"I predict that Lydia and many like her will continue to become even more and more bitter and antagonistic against all things SBC."

So, Jack, negative truths always mean bitterness to you? That is a great tactic to control information, though. Because folks always go on the defensive to try and prove they aren't bitter. I bet it works for you all the time. :o)

I am a bit disappointed you did not call it 'gossip' or 'slander'. Perhaps those are a bit overused these days?

"I am not too concerned for your good opinion as you are most unlikely to bestow it upon me". -Elizabeth Bennet (smile)


Jack Maddox said...

No Lydia, negative truths do not mean bitterness to me. Bitter people mean bitter, and you just seem very bitter and antagonistic. I feel sorry for you that is it all. I hope the new year will bring you the blessings of our great Lord and the ability to disagree and even dissent without a mean and condescending spirit.

Your comment towards me simply prooves my point.


Alan Stoddard said...

I always enjoy reading predictions.

Number 7 is the most intriguing to me. I do believe you are correct that media and non-traditional mediums and avenues will become more of a norm. People seem to resonate more with online campuses and small groups or non-traditional churches like coffee houses or as you say, "rented" venues.

I hope you're wrong on the gas. I go out on a limb and say it won't happen. I think we have brought the gas companies to their knees.

As for the SBC in Louisville, KY, I'm not sure it will be the lowest since 1800s. But I'll be waiting to see.

I've always wondered how the most evangelistic denomination in the past century can be so divided racially? It's amazing.

John said...

Lydia -

I was there when Highview and Valley Station merged. I'll bet you'd be surprised to hear that Valley Station's leadership contacted Highview and invited them to join them in a partnership.

But I doubt that this will mean much to you. You sound so full of hate towards anyone who disagrees with you that I doubt that anything like facts will stop your fury.

Just out of curiosity, do you live in Louisville? Do you know any of this first hand? Or are you just popping off heresay and lies others have told you?


Anonymous said...

"Your comment towards me simply prooves my point."

And your response doesn't prove the same thing about yourself?

Jack, you are a hoot. About every comment from you here is negative toward Wade and others....meaning YOU are bitter and antagonistic. I think they call this 'projecting' in psychology. :o)

We are quite a pair. I guess we can now debate which one of us is the more bitter? :o)

Come on, Jack. Have a good laugh at both our expense.

Your cheerful pal, Lydia

Anonymous said...

"I was there when Highview and Valley Station merged. I'll bet you'd be surprised to hear that Valley Station's leadership contacted Highview and invited them to join them in a partnership."

Nice try, John. The key to your comment is WHO is this 'leadership' you refer to and WHERE they came from.

BTW: That is some 'partnership'. There was a campaign and a vote. By how many did votes did Highview win?

If those who voted "no" and left to join New Salem decide to make what really happened behind the curtain, public as online including correspondance from Ezell to certain members, then I will give more details.

Until then, I am done. But we all know that someday God will make all things hidden, known.


John said...

Lydia -

So in other words, no, you don't have any firsthand knowledge of what went on.

When all this happened, I was working at a church about a mile up from Valley Station.

When a friend of mine at Valley Station asked me my opinion of a merge with Highview, I thought it was a great idea for them.

And so you know, I'm well aware of the vote.

The people who attended the church & invested their time and energy into it were enthusiastically for it.

Most of the votes of opposition came from "members" who had never graced the church with their prescence in years. In fact most people who were against it skipped the morning service, but were there for the vote right after the service was over.

You say you're done for the day. That's because your hand has been called, and it has been proven that you have no facts. Just hate for people different than you.

I so eagerly wait for the day that God will make all things hidden known.


traveller said...

On 4, I think hyperinflation is possible but unlikely, particularly as early as 2009. However, at some point the cost of petroleum related energy is likely to spike significantly higher than the $147/barrel of this year since petroleum exploration/development is coming to a dramatic halt with the drop in prices. Many projects are no longer economic at today's prices and there is less money available to spend on projects. This means as demand recovers there will be less supply forcing a higher cost for scarce supply. Then we will see the historical up swing of the cycle again. But it will take strong economic growth in India, China and Southeast Asia, in addition to the US, for that to happen. Maybe a couple of years, or more. Deflation may be our more immediate 2009 problem.

7. In my view, this movement is not "new", it has been going on for a decade or longer, just gaining momentum. The one area I disagree is that it will reflect more preaching of the word, at least not in the traditional sense. The "preaching of the word" will take more the form of relational teaching through the spoken word and the lived word and be more in smaller groupings and one on one.

9. I, for one, am glad you will have William P. Young in Enid.....and yes, it is likely that subject will fill your in box more than any other.....sadly.

Anonymous said...

In keeping with the good nature of Wade's blog posting and predictions . . .

The other "recruiting scandal": that Oklahoma's universities annually remain unable to find enough gifted players from among their own state's high school student-athletes to fill the roster of even one NCAA Division I university football team--but instead must each recruit up to 70% of their players from the football teams of Texas or other states' high schools (50% or more from Texas)--and still claim "Oklahoma wins!"

The latest recruiting records here: http://insider.espn.go.com/ncf/recruiting/tracker/conference?confId=4&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fncf%2frecruiting%2ftracker%2fconference%3fconfId%3d4

(UT: 19 high school player recruits listed--1 of them from outside of Texas, but O from Oklahoma high schools; OU: 23 players listed--18 from outside of Oklahoma, and 12 of the 18 from Texas high schools; TTU: 18 player recruits listed--3 from outside of Texas, but none of them from Oklahoma; OSU: 17 players listed, with 11 recruits from other states' high schools and 5 players listed from Texas; A&M: 27 players listed--3 from outside of Texas, but none of them from Oklahoma; Baylor: 20 high school players listed, but only 3 from outside of Texas--2 of them from Canada but no high school players recruited from Oklahoma!)


(Fan of the team that beat the team that beat the team that will lose its second game this season, to our brother-in-the-Lord-and-fellow-Baptist Tebow during the BCS Championship game)

Anonymous said...

Correction: 4 of OSU's recruits listed are junior college transfers--each from outside of Oklahoma, and 1 of them from Texas. Other recruit info correct as I worded the posting.


Anonymous said...

The Holy Spirit transforms souls when He is permitted to apply the Word of God shared accurately (not necessarily "preached") by some Christian. Otherwise, most folks present on Sundays cannot remember most of what their preachers preached two hours after lunch. ;~]


Doug Mize said...

Of course you will do better in the 09 predictions. No one could do worse. :) Also, many of these "predictions" will be up to interpretation where you can argue one side or the other. There is not much going out on the limb here. Not that a blame you after your past record. Happy New Year.

Anonymous said...

Hyper-inflation will keep oil/gas prices low. OPEC, et al, can't eat it and American won't be able to afford it.


Jack Maddox said...


Bless your heart, you really haven't a clue. Wade and I disagree on ages issues, most of which centers around his methodology. On most issues Wade and I agree. In fact, I consider Wade a friend. We are always friendly when we meet and I believe there is mutual respect. On many of the issues which Wade shares here, I simply think he is wrong. However, the issue of my post wasn't Wade, it was you. Not only are you wrong and less than truthful, your mean and spiteful! Isimply hope God will help you with this.


Anonymous said...

Fundamentalists will dominate the SBC if record low attendance occurs during 2009. Who else cares enough to attend in greater numbers? So the sadness will continue . . .

It primarily is congregations sustaining the intentional working of strategic plans for life-changing evangelistic ministry who recognize the need for state and national conventions; as there are very few of those kinds of churches in the SBC (fewer than 100?), the days of state and national conventions are just about done--unless leadership wakes up before it indeed is too late. Christendom in the U.S. needs today--much less in 2009--both spiritual revival AND administrative leadership in order to present a concerted gospel presentation to the nation (sustained church growth is a spiritual thing--but not all of it is; the other part of church growth is administrative/educational/leadership-related).


Wade Burleson said...


I like your "gossip" and "slander" come back to Jack. That was a good one that made me laugh.

Wade Burleson said...


I am a committed, loyal Southern Baptist. I provide a forum for people to speak their minds without fear of retribution.

Jesus himself said that judgement should begin within. I wholeheartedly agree with Lydia. Speaking the truth is not the same as being bitter. I measure my bitterness by the ability to laugh, and those who know me know that my ability to find genuine humor and lightheartedness in all my situations has not left.

And, as tomorrow's post will reveal, I will continue to speak the truth about the SBC.



Anonymous said...

I agree with Jack about you, Lydia.

You do come across as very bitter and angry. Even when you and I haven't disagreed on something and we had the simplest of exchanges, I felt what Jack is describing.

Even now, you have someone else who (taken at his word) has close knowledge about Highview, but you dismiss it because of your clear hatred for Mohler. It seems that facts only clutter your "mission".

You may not care how you come across and I suspect you don't, but there it is nonetheless.

I do wonder though:

If you ARE NOT a Southern Baptist, then why do you even care?

If you ARE a Southern Baptist, then why are you?

Perhaps Independent Baptist would work for you?

Hello Rex,

Thanks for the thoughtful reply and for not asking questions. :)

I hear what you are saying and I think I even understand it all.

I am left wondering though, and please help me here, but shouldn't we have some sort of guidance on interpretations? Not all knowing, but not all accepting either.

I'm not really sure about this and where to draw that line however. This is causing me to think through it, and that is a good thing.

Thinking out loud here: Should the doors be open for all and each one can divide scripture how they individually see fit? Or can we say as a group, here are some guidelines with grace inside those lines, but we offer a more strict "guidance" for those outside those lines.

I think that is indeed an important "s". I'm just not sure I would like what I saw if it were dropped and we had an anything goes religion.

Thanks for the pleasant interaction my friend.


Wade Burleson said...


I like Dr. Mohler. Both personally and theologically. I don't know Lydia, but I just think we ought to be careful claiming someone is "bitter" just because they happen to disagree with Mohler. Bitterness is in the heart, unseen by anyone but God, particularly in the person that we do not know personally. So, for what it is worth, I don't think Lydia is "bitter." I just think she disagrees with Mohler on some important issues.

Jack Maddox said...


That is all well and good, however, after this Thursday I will be here for you brother! I am your friend. There will be seasons of bitterness for you also, oh yes, wailing and gnashing of teeth o the cold bitter plains of Oklahoma come Thursday night!

FLA - 38
UO - 20


Jack Maddox said...


Jesus said that the mouth would speak forth the abundance of the heart. what's in a man or woman's heart will most often be reflected in their actions according to the Word of God. Lydia's actions (words) reflect anger and bitterness concerning SBC issues and those who hold a different opinion than her own. They betray the very title of this blog site and the stated convictions of the owner. Now that is simply my opinion. Is my opinion welcome on this blog or only those who are in lockstep with your views and vision for the SBC?


Anonymous said...


I am a former member of Highview Baptist Church (and to keep you from more idle speculation I left because I took a ministry position). I happen to know (not believe, not assume, not speculate, nor guess) that your accusations about Highview are misguided, and am somewhat inclined to believe that they are malicious. Your tone certainly seems rather harsh (cf. your comments about Dr. Moore suggesting his motives), but I hope that I am wrong about that. I do believe that you owe the great congregation of Highview and Dr. Ezell an apology.

BTW, perhaps Dr. Mohler going to Highview is not a sacrifice for the spirit of cooperation that some suggest, maybe he simply goes to a church where the pastor is a tremendous man of God and the congregation is wholly committed to making an impact for the Kingdom.



Jack Maddox said...


I a still waiting. The question was not rhetorical.


Justa Believer said...

Kevin M. Crowder said...
I know that sheep need a shepherd. Without one, they will graze themselves right off a cliff.

That I do know.

Good thing we have a Good Shepherd then, huh?

Anonymous said...

About that prediction number one:
it will be interesting to see how the Obama administration handles the new challenges.
One thing is for sure: they won't bury their heads in the sand or do a 'fly-over' the problems we face in the same way that the present 'ideologue' administration has done.
It will be good to have leadership that lives in the REAL world again.
Whatever people think of Obama, his choices for leadership so far are excellent. President-Elect Obama has already done more work than Bush did in eight years, and Obama hasn't been sworn in yet.

Oh, don't worry, the obstructionists are ready for him: strange, though, where was the Republican concern about spending when Bush took this country down?

Conservative Independent said...

Sadly, most of the Republicans in Washington haven't been any more concerned about rampant government spending than Democrats. Bush's main failing is in what he shares in common with Obama, not their differences.

Wade Burleson said...


Your opinion is always welcome on this blog.

So is my disagreement and gentle reminder that you don't know the heart of anyone.



Anonymous said...

"Bush's main failing is in what he shares in common with Obama, not their differences."

Trust me, if the voters saw ANY comparison between Bush and Obama, Obama would NEVER have been elected.

Basically, the vote for Obama was a vote against Bush, not a vote against John McCain.

Your argument is VERY fundamentalist: avoidance of reality at its best.

Jack Maddox said...


Then for 2009 when folks attack Kevin C on this blog I will be looking for you to gently remind them that they do not know his heart (and neither do you) : )

blessings for a new year of ministry and service to our king my brother! My prayer is that God richly blesses your ministry and your family.


Wade Burleson said...

Jack M.

Absolutely. Kevin should be given the same courtesy of Lydia. I think you will find Kevin believes he is given that from me.

Blessings to you too.


Kevin M. Crowder said...


You have not offended me in any way. In fact I meant to respond to a couple of your posts earlier, but this thread sort shot off like a rocket. First of all to the Dr. Moore topic. Southern Seminary is a research seminary. Professors are strongly encouraged to hold pastoral positions, write books, etc. Dr. Moore is a brilliant young theologian, professor, administrator (Administrative Dean and Dean of the School of Theology). He is also dynamic preacher and teacher. He moved his family from 9th and O Baptist Church in Louisville, where he taught "The Dean's Class." A Sunday School class the envy of the town. He now preaches almost every Sunday at Highview. He, Dr. Ezell and Cory Abney share this role from what I can see. So, this should come as no surprise that a Seminary Dean should preach on Sundays. Many Southern professors are Senior or associate pastors in the Louisville area. I think Dr. Ware is a deacon at his church. What a marvelous ministry to complete one's calling.

Now as to Valley Station. You obviously have some information the rest of us do not. But here is where we are: VSBC was ruled congregationally. It chose to merge. You or your "source" can call it smoke and mirrors or a dog and pony show that make the process slide under the radar.

But the fact remains that your source may have simply disagreed with the majority. Ok. I give them that. Lee Iacocca once said "Lead, Follow, or get out of the way. Lydia, trying the tear down the Highview leadership is not helpful to the Kingdom. If there were rally a viable story here, I assure you Wade would have uncovered or been privy to it. But I think a majority of a struggling church wanted to ride a "God Wave."

Rick Warren writes about God waves. You better jump on when you see them. So, to that matter, spill your proof or stop the sinful gossiping. "I know something you don't know and it makes 'your guy' look bad" is pretty lame conversation if you ask me--but you didn't.

Anyway, sounds like tomorrow might bring some interesting news. Maybe we can find common ground there. I do enjoy your posts.


Rex Ray said...

I admire you for sticking to your guns and not running away. I was wondering why you were getting so much criticism, but I figured it out—Jack is back. He’s a specialists when it comes to dishing it out.

I feel a little bad picking on him as he can’t fight back. You see, before he went away, he promised never to do any more “talkie-talkie” to me. To me, his comment that day was the most hilarious I’ve ever read.

But since this is a New Year maybe we can smoke the peace-pipe and communicate once again.

Keep on thinking; brother…you’re on the right track. You have expressed a fear that if the “s” was dropped there would be an ‘anything goes religion’.

Fundamentalists had the same fear so they built a wall of rules to keep sin out. They took freedom away and made prisoners within. They don’t trust the Holy Spirit to do His job without their rules.

They put their rules in the BFM and forced people to ‘bow’ as if were Nebuchadnezzar’s golden image. They even made it the “doctrinal guideline” which in my opinion makes it higher than the Bible.

Oh, if egos had weight, theirs would require wheelbarrows.

I know I’m a ‘black sheep’ (moderate) among most in this group…a little like L’s being Catholic.

I felt sorry for her trying to stop the ‘fighting’ by reminding us it’s a new day for worshiping the Lord

Anonymous said...

Wade - I hear your take on Lydia's heart and I appreciate it.

For the record, I am not certain Lydia is bitter. But I am certain she sounds bitter.


Anonymous said...

I'm in Bob Cleveland's Sunday School class and a fan of blog. A few comments on your predictions as a rabid college football fan (alumnus of U of Alabama) and news junkie.

I voted Obama (1st time I've ever voted Dem), and I believe you're right about Russia. Here's hoping the new prez shows foreign policy backbone. No reason to cave to Russia.

Your prediction about the SBC meeting is scary but likely true. I've been to a few of these as part of my work, and it's amazing how many messengers aren't even in the room when important votes are taken. Plus, Louisville isn't a destination city. Then again, neither is Birmingham (my home).

OU won't win the championship--although I wish they would. I'm sick of hearing about the Gators all the time. My beloved Crimson Tide came within about 5 minutes of meeting your Sooners, but it wasn't meant to be. The reason OU won't win is defense. Sooners have only played vs. 1 good one all year (TCU). The Big 12 is all offense. SEC is predicated upon defense. Florida's cornerbacks are the most talented you'll face all year and will likely ground your passing game. Bradford will be forced to stay in the pocket and be sacked a few times. My prediction: UF 34, OU 24.

May your thoughts on inflation fail to come true--or else we're all in trouble.

Ricky Gervais is a funny entertainer--but that's all he is. I don't think he'll ever be mistaken for an intellectual on matters of faith or lack thereof.

As a trained screenwriter, let me encourage you with this: I've attended a filmmaking seminar taught by Christians working in Hollywood. I learned there are more people of faith out there than you'd expect. Their influence is subtle more than it is overt.

Anonymous said...

I just wanted to comment on the Calvinism Arminianism debate that seems to be rampant in the SBC now. You are not going to find a true Southern Baptist that is a devout Arminian. No true Baptist will believe you can lose your salvation or choose to stop believing or at least one sitting in the pews. Since many on here seem to be fans of Hobbs and the 63 BF&M Hobbs stated in the fundamentals that both are clearly taught in scripture. To interpet Freewill passages and who so ever passages inlight of Calvinism is twisting scripture through the lens of a few obsture passages. To say God must enable a person to believe has salvation occuring before faith. I have friends who are devout Calvinist and have friends who are devout freewillers but I think Scripture clearly teaches the answer is in the middle

Anonymous said...

"To say God must enable a person to believe has salvation occuring before faith."

So, if this is true, then the WHOLE WORLD has a chance to be saved, not just the 'chosen' few.

I like this.

It makes God 'just' in my eyes.

It makes Christ's Sacrifice more meaningful as His Blood was shed for the benefit of mercy to ALL of God's children.

I like this, better than Calvinism. :)

Kevin M. Crowder said...

"in my eyes."

lol There is the flaw in your theology.

Anonymous said...

Kevin, read your Bible.
We are GOING to see God with our own eyes!

Job 19:25-27

"25 For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth:

26 And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:

27 Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another; though my reins be consumed within me."


Don't you read the Bible, Kevin?

'Be Thou My Vision" must really bother you a lot, but what exactly is making you so bitter and mean-spirited?

Out with it.
You have SO MUCH CONTEMPT for people on this blog, it is amazing.
But we still love YOU, Kevin.

Anonymous said...

I believe that you're already wrong on some of these with the Israel-Gaza conflict still looming as a challenge for Mr. Obama, and Oklahoma now having lost the national championship game.